Author Topic: MIOS Acquisition  (Read 46371 times)

Offline melih

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Re: MIOS Acquisition
« Reply #465 on: February 04, 2019, 01:46:25 pm »
>we are finalizing the details of the roadmap.
That must be very comlex roadmap, if toke a half a year, now imagine how long real updates will take ...

It is pretty complex actually. A change you make in firmware must be supported by both cloud and client apps (IOS/android etc).... There are huge architectural changes (we had to do, including a brand new cloud infrastructure, brand new hardware and much much more)....orchestracting all that was a humangous task. Added to that when we acquired the company had no "program management" function to orchestrate that....so we had to setup a whole new program management infrastructure, setup processes and so on....not sure if you fully understand and appreciate all of the above, but people in the know about how these things work will appreciate the scale of effort that has to go into this.

Offline Catman

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Re: MIOS Acquisition
« Reply #466 on: February 04, 2019, 01:56:53 pm »
>we are finalizing the details of the roadmap.
That must be very comlex roadmap, if toke a half a year, now imagine how long real updates will take ...

It is pretty complex actually. A change you make in firmware must be supported by both cloud and client apps (IOS/android etc).... There are huge architectural changes (we had to do, including a brand new cloud infrastructure, brand new hardware and much much more)....orchestracting all that was a humangous task. Added to that when we acquired the company had no "program management" function to orchestrate that....so we had to setup a whole new program management infrastructure, setup processes and so on....not sure if you fully understand and appreciate all of the above, but people in the know about how these things work will appreciate the scale of effort that has to go into this.

That actually gives me some confidence, thanks

C

Offline JTG

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Re: MIOS Acquisition
« Reply #467 on: February 04, 2019, 01:57:28 pm »
Soo.. how soon will the VeraProtect service be available to sign up again? I know people on the Beta are still running.  I was hoping to set up the new system this month, but without the option for monitoring, its a no-go.


By the way, the addition of monitoring was HUGE for me and people I work with...I have 2 full systems monitored now.

Feel free to PM me if this dialogue should move off the public forum.

Offline Sender

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Re: MIOS Acquisition
« Reply #468 on: February 04, 2019, 02:37:46 pm »

Will be out this month? Then its 7 after ezlo took over? What happened in the mean time? To vera and zwave device support?

I don't know how you count or what kind of calendar you are using, but I make it six months from August to February using the Gregorian Calendar.

The acquisition was announced August 16. It will be six months February 16.

Besides, Melih said "in six months time". Not a date. That could very well be end of February, it is still "in six months time".
I suggest we cut them some slack here. Let's see what shows up before judging.

I said "then". End of this month (thats still this month) I expect just on the last day a message "almost there". And then it's 6.5 months (yes not 7 but almost). But lets hope I am wrong.
Good firmware is more important than good karma. (and this costed me lots of Karma)

Offline ivx

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Re: MIOS Acquisition
« Reply #469 on: February 05, 2019, 12:42:43 am »
For me cloud part is just ""tilu lilu. Vera device is brain of system and if firmware not stable what use i get from cloud services ?
If check forum, practically all problems are related to firmware.

I'm sofware developer and i understand how such things will work. Form my point of view you started from wrong edge, unless you move all local processing from Vera device cloud and make it cloud only device ... is this the case ?

Online rafale77

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Re: MIOS Acquisition
« Reply #470 on: February 05, 2019, 12:48:24 am »
@melih, you must feel encouraged to have all these folks excited and eager to see the outcome of all your team's work!  ;D
I can definitely feel from my investigation into my vera plus hardware and OS and from all the comments we are seeing from the developers what you say about lack of program management.
Time to market is important and it was one of the key advantages Vera had from the beginning but over time many left mostly because of lack of reliability and to a lesser degree lack of evolutionary support. We all hope for your future success. This platform has so much potential...
I do want to say that what has been limiting you has been the weakness in the hardware preventing the platform to satisfy its ambitions for various integrations and intensive cloud connections. I hope that you take into consideration a cloudless/app less solution or at least a cloud independent mode which has always been another one of the vera's selling points. I have gone from a Vera Lite to a Vera Edge to now a Vera Plus every time because I was disappointed by the poor processing capability and the resulting instability.
I will for my part patiently wait for a significant breakthrough solution.
I do want to bring to your attention also that:
1. Cloud device integration is completely taken care of in my mind by home-assistant which is entirely community driven and in my opinion is completely impossible to match for a single company in terms of speed of fixes and rate of new additions due to resources. To top it all it is open source. I do not think this is where your focus should be. Instead, maybe integrate it into your platform as a plugin. You seem to have been focused on many integrations which I am sorry to say have almost all been done better by the community. I don't think this is where you should focus and should just open up the API for it to be community driven.
2. Mobile Apps Many 3rd party mobile apps on this forum are offering customization and features which are already very satisfactory. Your first beta releases seem to all be mobile platform. It would not be where I would spend my efforts either. You will not be able to differentiate there more than vera already has with the API and 3rd party apps. Having a better mobile app helps, no question, but will not be what sells the product.
3. The hardware and the luup engine, device handling and support with an API is where the key is and is what the market is asking for something better. The object oriented interface for the device handling and the automation layer of the luup engine are the areas of both strength and in need of large improvements in terms of stability and self consistency. This is the core from which you can build the rest.

Cloud is good but must be an extra candy for additional features. It cannot be the core.
openLuup (78 devices, 141 scenes, 19 apps) master to VeraPlus (142 zwave nodes, 8 Zigbee nodes, 221 devices,  20 scenes , 2 apps) +  Hubitat (15 Zigbee nodes) + Home-Assistant (API Integrations). Bridged to Siri and Alexa. Homewave. VeraPlus ExtRooted and mios server independent.

Offline Quixote

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Re: MIOS Acquisition
« Reply #471 on: February 05, 2019, 01:26:16 am »
Well, since we're all telling what Melih to do...    ;)
I would suggest he contact Ron Bessems, creator of the now defunct Girder and founder of Promixis. He's moved on to greener pastures (or rather, more noble work -- PEAC -- See: https://vimeo.com/105235218 ), but throw a figure at him that he can't refuse and you might get lucky. Best home automation software I've ever used in my life (over 20 years of messing with this stuff and wasting my money on various experiments and toys). The man is brilliant and while I came to Vera to avoid having to run a PC all the time for HA, I've always missed Girder since it easily rivaled Homeseer and was only close to a hundred bucks with no plugin fees unless an individual developer decided to charge for something they made.
My "Karma" has been modified by 2 or 3 douchebags that didn't like that I criticized the plugin that they worship. I'm not actually a bad person. (I guess I'm "Chaotic Neutral").

Offline melih

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Re: MIOS Acquisition
« Reply #472 on: February 05, 2019, 09:33:51 am »
For me cloud part is just ""tilu lilu. Vera device is brain of system and if firmware not stable what use i get from cloud services ?
If check forum, practically all problems are related to firmware.

I'm sofware developer and i understand how such things will work. Form my point of view you started from wrong edge, unless you move all local processing from Vera device cloud and make it cloud only device ... is this the case ?

Yes you are making the wrong assumption thinking that we only "re-wrote" the cloud. We also re-wrote the firmware! Now runs much faster and more stable in the labs....

Offline melih

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Re: MIOS Acquisition
« Reply #473 on: February 05, 2019, 09:38:25 am »
@melih, you must feel encouraged to have all these folks excited and eager to see the outcome of all your team's work!  ;D
I can definitely feel from my investigation into my vera plus hardware and OS and from all the comments we are seeing from the developers what you say about lack of program management.
Time to market is important and it was one of the key advantages Vera had from the beginning but over time many left mostly because of lack of reliability and to a lesser degree lack of evolutionary support. We all hope for your future success. This platform has so much potential...
I do want to say that what has been limiting you has been the weakness in the hardware preventing the platform to satisfy its ambitions for various integrations and intensive cloud connections. I hope that you take into consideration a cloudless/app less solution or at least a cloud independent mode which has always been another one of the vera's selling points. I have gone from a Vera Lite to a Vera Edge to now a Vera Plus every time because I was disappointed by the poor processing capability and the resulting instability.
I will for my part patiently wait for a significant breakthrough solution.
I do want to bring to your attention also that:
1. Cloud device integration is completely taken care of in my mind by home-assistant which is entirely community driven and in my opinion is completely impossible to match for a single company in terms of speed of fixes and rate of new additions due to resources. To top it all it is open source. I do not think this is where your focus should be. Instead, maybe integrate it into your platform as a plugin. You seem to have been focused on many integrations which I am sorry to say have almost all been done better by the community. I don't think this is where you should focus and should just open up the API for it to be community driven.
2. Mobile Apps Many 3rd party mobile apps on this forum are offering customization and features which are already very satisfactory. Your first beta releases seem to all be mobile platform. It would not be where I would spend my efforts either. You will not be able to differentiate there more than vera already has with the API and 3rd party apps. Having a better mobile app helps, no question, but will not be what sells the product.
3. The hardware and the luup engine, device handling and support with an API is where the key is and is what the market is asking for something better. The object oriented interface for the device handling and the automation layer of the luup engine are the areas of both strength and in need of large improvements in terms of stability and self consistency. This is the core from which you can build the rest.

Cloud is good but must be an extra candy for additional features. It cannot be the core.

thanks for the feedback.

IOS, Android, Web, Cloud, Firmware, Hardware, Integration teams are all different departments with their own resources, with their own product and program management teams. The reason why you are seeing mobile teams delivering their code first is because they didn't have to re-write everything from scratch, therefore are able to start delivering faster than other departments.


Offline ivx

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Re: MIOS Acquisition
« Reply #474 on: February 05, 2019, 12:59:29 pm »
We do assumptions because you don't share whats in work, just make forum thread and put some general(no need for roadmap) info up what's going behind scenes and what you have achived so far ...

Offline Grwebster

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Re: MIOS Acquisition
« Reply #475 on: February 05, 2019, 08:10:06 pm »
@melih, you must feel encouraged to have all these folks excited and eager to see the outcome of all your team's work!  ;D
I can definitely feel from my investigation into my vera plus hardware and OS and from all the comments we are seeing from the developers what you say about lack of program management.
Time to market is important and it was one of the key advantages Vera had from the beginning but over time many left mostly because of lack of reliability and to a lesser degree lack of evolutionary support. We all hope for your future success. This platform has so much potential...
I do want to say that what has been limiting you has been the weakness in the hardware preventing the platform to satisfy its ambitions for various integrations and intensive cloud connections. I hope that you take into consideration a cloudless/app less solution or at least a cloud independent mode which has always been another one of the vera's selling points. I have gone from a Vera Lite to a Vera Edge to now a Vera Plus every time because I was disappointed by the poor processing capability and the resulting instability.
I will for my part patiently wait for a significant breakthrough solution.
I do want to bring to your attention also that:
1. Cloud device integration is completely taken care of in my mind by home-assistant which is entirely community driven and in my opinion is completely impossible to match for a single company in terms of speed of fixes and rate of new additions due to resources. To top it all it is open source. I do not think this is where your focus should be. Instead, maybe integrate it into your platform as a plugin. You seem to have been focused on many integrations which I am sorry to say have almost all been done better by the community. I don't think this is where you should focus and should just open up the API for it to be community driven.
2. Mobile Apps Many 3rd party mobile apps on this forum are offering customization and features which are already very satisfactory. Your first beta releases seem to all be mobile platform. It would not be where I would spend my efforts either. You will not be able to differentiate there more than vera already has with the API and 3rd party apps. Having a better mobile app helps, no question, but will not be what sells the product.
3. The hardware and the luup engine, device handling and support with an API is where the key is and is what the market is asking for something better. The object oriented interface for the device handling and the automation layer of the luup engine are the areas of both strength and in need of large improvements in terms of stability and self consistency. This is the core from which you can build the rest.

Cloud is good but must be an extra candy for additional features. It cannot be the core.

thanks for the feedback.

IOS, Android, Web, Cloud, Firmware, Hardware, Integration teams are all different departments with their own resources, with their own product and program management teams. The reason why you are seeing mobile teams delivering their code first is because they didn't have to re-write everything from scratch, therefore are able to start delivering faster than other departments.
Looking forward to your announcement.


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Offline melih

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Re: MIOS Acquisition
« Reply #476 on: February 13, 2019, 07:15:40 pm »
we are now in a position to start issuing public dates for deliverables. We will do so shortly. This is going to be the very first version. There will be many more coming as teams mature but the first one will be a great start and we will keep it coming and provide our users visibility into our development roadmap going forward.

Offline Grwebster

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Re: MIOS Acquisition
« Reply #477 on: February 13, 2019, 07:20:11 pm »
Looking forward to it!


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Offline tomtcom

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Re: MIOS Acquisition
« Reply #478 on: February 13, 2019, 09:48:59 pm »
Excited to see the release notes melih.

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Offline korttoma

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Re: MIOS Acquisition
« Reply #479 on: February 14, 2019, 02:26:02 am »
Eager to see what the first version of the roadmap will show melih  ;)
- Tomas