Author Topic: Kira IR Receiver and Transmitter Plugins  (Read 62620 times)

Offline parkerc

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Re: Kira IR Receiver and Transmitter Plugins
« Reply #15 on: May 03, 2013, 12:42:54 pm »
Hi Lolodomo

Is the plugin working with the Kira IR anywhere and the kira128 ?
Considering this plugin and Vera usage, is there a reason to choose the kira128 rather than the Kira ?

There should be no real difference in performance with the plugin, the main difference is the amount of memory that the 128 has available, that way it can store more IR codes onboard - however if you are using the Plugin (Rex's or the one I fumbled together) the codes are stored in an XML on Vera so one board memory is not important..  (there is also a KIRA128 RS232, just to confused things)

Can a unique Kira be used internally as a IR relay (transmit a IR signal it receives) ? If not, I imagine that the plugin can allow to do it ? But there will be a noticeable delay between receive and transmit ?

Rex - has done a Receive and a Transmitter plugin, so it keep both of them seperate, so currently the code will have to be stored first before it can be transmitted - however I think that is most likely to be the way you would use it)

Is the signal strength of the Kira good ? How much directive is the Kira ? Angle ?

it's OK, but you can update the transmitter and also the received sensor, so there are a lot of options.
I have my Kira connected to a IR Distribution unit, so Kira is actually hidden away
 
How many devices can be controlled by the Kira when using an additional transmitter cable ? Can we use only the Keene cable or can we use cables from other brands ? http://www.keene.co.uk/pages/iranywhere/Accessories.html The Kira can be used used with a Powermid ? The Powermid could act as a RF relay and then send the IR signal to the Kira through a jack cable ?

Out of the box, you are looking at line of site for Kira however the additon of the Distribution unit or an IR Commander will allow you to contol lots of devices with dedcated IR Emmiters

Hope tha helps you Lolodomo

Offline RexBeckett

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Re: Kira IR Receiver and Transmitter Plugins
« Reply #16 on: May 03, 2013, 07:28:50 pm »
I think @parkerc answered most of your questions. If not, there is a lot of information about how to connect different IR sensors and transmitters - including those from other manufacturers - on the Keene Electronics website: http://www.keene.co.uk/ under the Infra Red tab.

Regarding the plugins for Kira, as they currently stand the following is possible:

The IR receiver plugin (KiraRx) can receive codes from any number of Kira modules that are on the same IP subnet as Vera and on the same UDP port. You can also set the IPaddress field in the plugin so it will only accept codes from a single module. You could create multiple KiraRx devices to handle codes from specific Kira modules if you set unique UDP port numbers for each module and plugin.

The IR transmitter plugin (KiraTx) is associated with a specific Kira module by IPaddress and UDP port. You could create multiple KiraTx devices to service multiple Kira modules. To receive codes for learning, KiraTx searches for a KiraRx device using the same UDP port. If it finds one, it will use it to receive the codes. If it doesn't find one, it will set up its own UDP socket to its associated Kira module and learn the codes directly.

So, you have a fair amount of flexibility. I don't think there is any need to have multiple Kira modules in a single room. As @parkerc has explained, you can use IR distribution units to feed multiple emitters and/or blasters. For multiple rooms, there could be justification for having dedicated Kira modules for each. Each module would need its own KiraTx device. It could also have its own KiraRx device if you set unique UDP port numbers.

I have not incorporated any particular mechanism in the plugins to forward IR codes. You could use scenes triggered by a specific code to transmit that - or a different - code through a particular kira module but there would be some latency. There are other solutions for this which may be faster. See Keene Electronics site for Powermid and other IR Extenders.

Offline lolodomo

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Re: Kira IR Receiver and Transmitter Plugins
« Reply #17 on: May 05, 2013, 06:02:39 am »
Thank you for your answers.

Can you confirm than in standalone mode, the Kira sends on its IR output all the IR signals it receives on its IR input ?

Please tell me if this setup is ok:
- IRSR as IR receiver
- KLD4010 (10 m cable) between the IR receiver and the Kira
- Kira
- 3,5 mm stereo jack between the IR output of the Kira and to the IR input of the IRBKIT
- IRBKIT as IR distribution amp
- IRBW or IRDW or IRUW or IRHPW as IR emitters

In this setup, I can use IR remotes or Vera+kira to send IR codes.

Regarding the connection between the Kira and the distribution kit, I probably need the KLDE6M, a stereo jack 3.5mm. My french dealer does not provide this cable. Can a standard jack cable work or is it a real specific cable with standard connectors ?

----------

An alternative would be to have a splitter as input of the distribution kit, with two IR inputs, the IR receiver and the Kira. Is it better ? That would avoid to pass through the Kira for IR codes coming from the remotes. Kira will be used only from the Vera.

----------

Alternative to avoid the long cable ?
- Powermid extender
- Powermid transmitter in front of the IR led of the Kira
...

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Of course, I imagine a last alternative would be to use the Kira as the main and unique receiver but it requires an IP access at this location and the Kira box is not really beautiful ;D
« Last Edit: May 05, 2013, 06:19:47 am by lolodomo »

Offline RexBeckett

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Re: Kira IR Receiver and Transmitter Plugins
« Reply #18 on: May 05, 2013, 07:52:33 am »
Quote
Can you confirm than in standalone mode, the Kira sends on its IR output all the IR signals it receives on its IR input ?
No - it does not do this. A single module will receive IR and send it via UDP and receive UDP and send it via IR. It is not an IR repeater. You can use a pair of modules to achieve this, though.

Quote
... the Kira box is not really beautiful
Very true but, if you use an external IR sensor and emitter, it can be invisible.  ;D

Sorry but I'm off to work so I cannot answer your other questions right now.

Offline parkerc

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Re: Kira IR Receiver and Transmitter Plugins
« Reply #19 on: May 05, 2013, 12:30:12 pm »
Regarding the connection between the Kira and the distribution kit, I probably need the KLDE6M, a stereo jack 3.5mm. My french dealer does not provide this cable. Can a standard jack cable work or is it a real specific cable with standard connectors ?

Sadly you cannot use a standard stereo 3.5 jack for this, so it does need to be a specific one. I have a splitter on my distribution unit for the KIRA and a standard IR receiver. Doing it this way, the KIRA can make use of all the emitters running from the distribution unit. 

Offline RexBeckett

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Re: Kira IR Receiver and Transmitter Plugins
« Reply #20 on: May 05, 2013, 05:23:17 pm »
Back from work.  :)

As @parkerc has explained, you should not use a standard 3.5mm stereo cable to connect the IR output from one module to the IR input of another. Doing so may cause damage as the ring part of an output connector carries a 5 volt supply. If you cannot get the correct cable (KLDE6M) then you could make one with two 3.5mm 3-pin (stereo) jack-plugs and some single-core screened audio cable. The cable screen/shield needs to connect to the jack Body and the inner wire should connect to the jack Tip. The jack Ring should not be connected. See the following information from Keene for details:
Quote
http://www.keene.co.uk/pages/downloads/dnl_files/pdfs/Keene_IR_Receiver_and_Emitters_Connections.pdf

I think you will need a splitter so you can have IR from remotes feeding into the IRKIT along with Vera-generated codes through the KIRA. @parkerc has teted this for you.  ;D

The only other question is if you want to learn codes for KiraTx through KIRA. You can do this using the built-in IR receiver if it is in a suitable place. Otherwise you may need an additional IR receiver for this task. If you know the codes in Pronto (or KIRA) format, you can import them to KiraTx. I like to learn the codes directly in to the plugin but all the imported codes I have tried work fine. I also used the free Java program from Keene to capture KIRA codes which I then copy/pasted into KiraTx again with no problems. If you are learning codes with KIRA, I recommend using the remote from the normal operating distance.


Offline lolodomo

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Re: Kira IR Receiver and Transmitter Plugins
« Reply #21 on: May 06, 2013, 08:01:56 am »
Thank you again for all the explanations but bad news in final.
I will ask my dealer if he can provide the required elements and/or check if Keene is shipping outside of UK.

But finally, what would be the advantages of the Keene solution compared to Global Cach? iTach ?


Offline lolodomo

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Re: Kira IR Receiver and Transmitter Plugins
« Reply #22 on: May 06, 2013, 08:10:35 am »
And in case I would like to combine the Powermid RF extender with the Keene distribution kit, do I need only this special Jack cable or do I need something more ?

Edit: this cable is available on my second usual dealer 8)

For the jack splitter allowing to have two inputs in the distribution amp, is it again a special adaptor or not ? Because this time this adaptor is available only on the Keene site.
« Last Edit: May 06, 2013, 08:22:27 am by lolodomo »

Offline lolodomo

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Re: Kira IR Receiver and Transmitter Plugins
« Reply #23 on: May 06, 2013, 10:02:52 am »
It looks like Keene is recommending the KA203 http://www.keene.co.uk/multi.php?mycode=KA203
rather than the KA109 http://www.keene.co.uk/electronic/unbranded/3.5mm-stereo-plug-to-2-x-3.5mm-stereo-sockets/KA109.html
as input splitter for the IRBKIT.
Parkerc, is it the one you are using ?

Offline parkerc

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Re: Kira IR Receiver and Transmitter Plugins
« Reply #24 on: May 06, 2013, 01:44:04 pm »
It looks like Keene is recommending the KA203 http://www.keene.co.uk/multi.php?mycode=KA203
rather than the KA109 http://www.keene.co.uk/electronic/unbranded/3.5mm-stereo-plug-to-2-x-3.5mm-stereo-sockets/KA109.html
as input splitter for the IRBKIT.
Parkerc, is it the one you are using ?

I've had mine for a number of years now, but I seem to recall mine is just a stereo splitter, the one Keene are recommending however looks better, so much so I'm tempted to get one myself..

Offline RexBeckett

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Re: Kira IR Receiver and Transmitter Plugins
« Reply #25 on: May 06, 2013, 03:18:23 pm »
Quote
But finally, what would be the advantages of the Keene solution compared to Global Cach? iTach ?
If you only want to send IR codes from Vera, I don't think there is an advantage in using a KIRA over an iTach. I have been using an iTach with Pronto codes and it worked fine. I started working with KIRA because I wanted to receive IR codes into Vera and iTach can't do that. Using KIRA to transmit IR was @parkerc's idea - some time ago - and he created his own plugin to do it. I made a transmit plugin for KIRA, at his suggestion (that's credit, not blame  ;D), to fully utilise the KIRA module. In my case, it has just saved me one port on my switch but I now have a redundant iTach.  ::)

Offline lolodomo

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Re: Kira IR Receiver and Transmitter Plugins
« Reply #26 on: May 07, 2013, 06:47:47 pm »
Finally, if I want to receive and transmit with the Kira and the Vera, that requires a double connection between the Kira and the distribution amp (IRBKIT),
1 - for transmitting, I need to connect the Kira IR output to the IR input of the distribution amp
2 - for receiving, I need to connect one of the IR output of the distribution amp to the Kira IR input. Doing that, Vera will be notified by IR code received from the main IR receiver connected to the distribution amp (splitter required to have as input the Kira and the IR receiver, and Kira is invisible)
There will be no loop with IR codes as the Kira output is not linked to the IR input.
Is it right ?

Offline RexBeckett

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Re: Kira IR Receiver and Transmitter Plugins
« Reply #27 on: May 07, 2013, 08:11:40 pm »
I believe that is right. I don't use an IR distribution amp but I am using a single KIRA to both receive and transmit IR to/from Vera along with the blaster output of my Logitech Harmony 1100. I have no collision issues. As far as I can see, the receive and transmit functions of the KIRA are completely separate - apart from the transmitter sending ACKs over the receiver's UDP port when it is sent a packet to transmit - but my KiraRx plugin deals with that.

Offline lolodomo

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Re: Kira IR Receiver and Transmitter Plugins
« Reply #28 on: May 17, 2013, 03:20:27 pm »
Really not obvious to make this Kira works !

Currently, when I push the learn button and then push a button on my IR remote in front of the Kira IR receiver, nothing happens.

So, I would like first to check on my PC. But when I start the program (either Kira.exe or KIRA.jar), I only get this error message: "Could not find the main class: KIRA.KIRA. Program will exit."
I have a JRE 1.6. Another of my Java application is working well so I imagine the JRE is correctly setup on my PC.
Any help would be appreciated ?


Regarding the IR amplifier kit (alone without the Kira), I have made a basic test and it seems to work well.

Offline lolodomo

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Re: Kira IR Receiver and Transmitter Plugins
« Reply #29 on: May 17, 2013, 03:32:14 pm »
Here is the errors:

java -jar "C:\Data\IRAnywhere\Java Utility Program\Kira.jar"
Exception in thread "main" java.lang.UnsupportedClassVersionError: KIRA/KIRA : Unsupported major.minor version 51.0
        at java.lang.ClassLoader.defineClass1(Native Method)
        at java.lang.ClassLoader.defineClassCond(Unknown Source)
        at java.lang.ClassLoader.defineClass(Unknown Source)
        at java.security.SecureClassLoader.defineClass(Unknown Source)
        at java.net.URLClassLoader.defineClass(Unknown Source)
        at java.net.URLClassLoader.access$000(Unknown Source)
        at java.net.URLClassLoader$1.run(Unknown Source)
        at java.security.AccessController.doPrivileged(Native Method)
        at java.net.URLClassLoader.findClass(Unknown Source)
        at java.lang.ClassLoader.loadClass(Unknown Source)
        at sun.misc.Launcher$AppClassLoader.loadClass(Unknown Source)
        at java.lang.ClassLoader.loadClass(Unknown Source)
Could not find the main class: KIRA.KIRA. Program will exit.