Author Topic: License for PLEG and PLTS Plugins (Starting April 1, 2014)  (Read 82355 times)

Offline S-F

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Re: License for PLEG and PLTS Plugins (Starting April 1, 2014)
« Reply #30 on: February 28, 2014, 10:15:59 am »
It's no the number of conditions which is limited. It's the number of PL devices which you can create per license. Four Program Logic devices per license. Unlimited conditions per device. So in theory you could have one license, one PL device and hundreds of conditions.
My forum account was apparently hacked by a leprechaun. And he's drunk all of the time. If a post of mine seems a little off kilter, it's probably because he made it.

Offline dbmet

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Re: License for PLEG and PLTS Plugins (Starting April 1, 2014)
« Reply #31 on: February 28, 2014, 11:23:45 am »
So I will ask It this way. Why limit the number of devices. I paid for the plugin. Whether it's 4 or 6 devices how does it effect the developer. I'm only installing it on one vera device.
If I buy a license for a computer program  and I can only install it on that computer. But then when I launch that program it only allows me to create 50 word documents. Then after 50 word documents I have to pay again.



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Offline RichardTSchaefer

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Re: License for PLEG and PLTS Plugins (Starting April 1, 2014)
« Reply #32 on: February 28, 2014, 12:37:53 pm »
You can do a lot more with pure LUA and Scenes for FREE.

But I love the free market economy in the USA. And this is another small experiment in that great concept.
This is  called value based licensing. If you use it a lot ... it has more value.

There is no way I will ever recover the dollar value for the time I invested in this product. It's not a goal!
So what does the developer get out this ?
Mostly satisfaction in providing something that others place a value in. So when you buy a license ... it's like buying me a beer and saying ... nice job!

And if it's no body places a value in it  ... and I get thirsty ... I will find something else that might interest you.




Offline BulldogLowell

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Re: License for PLEG and PLTS Plugins (Starting April 1, 2014)
« Reply #33 on: February 28, 2014, 01:21:35 pm »
Richard,

During the recent (not latest) updates there was a little noise on issues that came about as a result of the updates.  So, I disabled auto-update on PLEG and I am presently holding on Version 5.93.  I have been on the sidelines whilst you manage the latest update, as I am eager to add the new functions in your latest version.

Because I am nuts about being able to get back to where I was, I want to backup my Veras (I have a few) so that I know I will be able to return to a 'operating' backup if down the road I have a problem with say the upgrade to UI6 or with an update with PLEG (or another plugin for that matter).  This is sort of critical for me because I manage some of this while I am away from our summer/winter home.  A functioning Vera is super important to me, being at the bleeding edge on software runs a distant second.

I hope that you could clarify for me (or us) wether:

a) I need to get a license key for Version 5.93 and
b) If I choose to remain on it while I watch the upgrade chatter get resolved, will I have to register 5.93 within the timeline you outlined.

Like I said, I want to assure myself that I can get back to a happy place if everything goes pear-shaped.

The reason I am asking is because I cannot seem to locate exactly where in version 5.93 I would purchase a license.

And finally, are we to assume your license is good for 4 PLEG devices regardless of how many units there are on my account?

Thanks in advance for your assistance and like the others, I appreciate what your tools bring to Vera.

P.S. I hope a percentage go to Rex for his amazing support of your brilliant work  ;D

Offline SirMeili

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Re: License for PLEG and PLTS Plugins (Starting April 1, 2014)
« Reply #34 on: February 28, 2014, 01:26:00 pm »
So I will ask It this way. Why limit the number of devices. I paid for the plugin. Whether it's 4 or 6 devices how does it effect the developer. I'm only installing it on one vera device.
If I buy a license for a computer program  and I can only install it on that computer. But then when I launch that program it only allows me to create 50 word documents. Then after 50 word documents I have to pay again.



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I've been recently looking into Windows Server Licensing for my company. You want to feel like their bending you over and taking advantage, then go look that up. Server licensing, THEN user licensing.... THEN if you want remote acccess, RDS CALs are needed... Want to use MORE Ram (Yes, if you have 128GB in yoru server and have standard, you can only use 64GB of it)? Better upgrade to Datacenter edition then (Standard is limited to 64GB for 2012). Want to access more CPUs? Datacenter again (from ~$900 to over $6k PER MACHINE!).

To be fair though, going from Standard to Datacenter does allow you to create unlimited VMs on that one machine using that license for all the OSes for the VMs. Standard you can only do 2. Still, though, If I am building a SQL Server (which I am), and I want more ram, my OS cost just went from $900 to $6k just to add more than 64GB of ram.

I think that $5.5 for 4 devices is fair in this case. I understand where you are coming from, but it's a small price to pay to support someone who has done a TON for this community.
« Last Edit: February 28, 2014, 04:29:28 pm by SirMeili »
VeraLite (Live); ISY 994i (Live); Vera 3 (Waiting to replace VeraLite); Vera Edge (Waiting for all the bugs to be fixed); Xuan StackBox (Testing and waiting for more plugins and for it to mature)
Countless z-wave and insteon devices :D

Offline RichardTSchaefer

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Re: License for PLEG and PLTS Plugins (Starting April 1, 2014)
« Reply #35 on: February 28, 2014, 03:30:36 pm »
@Bulldoglowell
I totally understand managing your configuration ...
I will document the procedure later this month  for how to obtain and install a license.

Actually the software to request a license has been in all versions since last November.
It's just disabled in your version.



« Last Edit: February 28, 2014, 03:32:56 pm by RichardTSchaefer »

Offline BulldogLowell

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Re: License for PLEG and PLTS Plugins (Starting April 1, 2014)
« Reply #36 on: February 28, 2014, 03:35:47 pm »
Understood, and thanks.

I'm just standing by to let you work out the release issues on the latest version.

I'm liking the idea of putting Lua into PLEG and that is definitely worth getting the upgrade.

I hope you earn lots of 'beers'  ;)


Offline Peter

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Re: License for PLEG and PLTS Plugins (Starting April 1, 2014)
« Reply #37 on: February 28, 2014, 05:16:47 pm »

@ RichardTSchaefer Can I use the same licence with the same Vera 3 and the U16 version?

I' have send four times a mail to my Hotmail but I didn't receive anything!

http://rts-services-registration.appspot.com/?License=PLC&VeraID=123456
An email has been sent. Click the link embedded in the Email to Verify your Email Address
« Last Edit: February 28, 2014, 05:51:50 pm by Peter »

Offline RichardTSchaefer

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Re: License for PLEG and PLTS Plugins (Starting April 1, 2014)
« Reply #38 on: February 28, 2014, 06:18:20 pm »
Did you check your Spam filter ?


The license will work on UI5 or UI6 ... but it is tied to the same physical Vera.


Offline parkerc

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Re: License for PLEG and PLTS Plugins (Starting April 1, 2014)
« Reply #39 on: February 28, 2014, 07:13:56 pm »
Hi Richard

In the spirit of this forum, I wanted to share with you my thoughts on this..

For me your announcement was a big surprise, mainly because this is the first real step I've seen that moves this forum away from being a close community of contributors, creating and sharing free apps, to one based on a more commercial model. (Please Note - I fully accept this is an area that's been in the background with Vera for a while, (you only have to look at the App Store) but this is the first real step towards embracing such a change and a charge)

You mentioned earlier that when you started this, it was a personal project, one which you decided to share. And like many others out there who  share they work freely here, I really really appreciate what you do and what you've created , and i do accept your statement, about how you went into this particular venture with good intentions (if I try to read between those lines, you're maybe also trying to  say that you never had such a revenue model/stream in mind when you launched it -  I hope that's true.)

Now before I'm jumped on by others for being rude or ungrateful, please understand that I'm not saying that charging for such great work is wrong; (far from it) it's a very good product and you have every right (and deserve) to seek revenue for the time/effort you've done.

What I will say however, is that I would've liked your timing to have been better e.g using UI6 or the new hardware upgrade later in the year would've been an ideal point to initiate such a change (now that's just my humble opinion)

Please understand, (inc. all that are reading this)  I hold this forum and it's members in very highest regard, it truly is one of the very best and most supportive/collaborative HA spaces out there (and I've been on a few) . So please respect my desire to talk openly and honestly about my thoughts/feelings on what you have done .

It's not personal, it's very much more about what your approach represents a) to those of us on the forum and b) also to our future use/cost of Vera
« Last Edit: March 01, 2014, 04:07:08 am by parkerc »

Offline dbmet

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Re: License for PLEG and PLTS Plugins (Starting April 1, 2014)
« Reply #40 on: February 28, 2014, 08:09:50 pm »
I agree in that I don't mind paying for the plugin. Its like paying for an app in the App store.

I think its a little strange to be limited to 4 pleg devices when before it was unlimited and I wasn't paying anything. I'm not sure how limiting it to 4 plegs affects the developer except to make money if you have more than 4 Plegs you have created when it was free.

Its kind of like me writing an iPhone app and offering it for free for the vera . Then one day I start charging 5.99 for it and I limit it to 10 vera z-wave or misc devices you can use. Then if you want the rest of the devices you would pay another 5.99.  That to me seems shady.. 


Offline TC1

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Re: License for PLEG and PLTS Plugins (Starting April 1, 2014)
« Reply #41 on: February 28, 2014, 09:22:55 pm »
To whom it may concern-

<soapbox>

If you've read any of my posts, you hopefully realize my style is not to scold people, but to try to help. I believe we are all put on this Earth to help each other, not compete with each to gather the most $$$ and die with it.

Anyone who complains about spending ~$6 to make a >$170 device and investment work properly should have their head examined. I guarantee most of you have bought $199 phones and have spent a few dollars in the App stores buying programs to make them more fun or useful in your life. That's what Richard's programs do for Vera.

Anyone who complains about not getting more than 4 PLEG devices for the extremely small license fee doesn't understand technically why you wouldn't want more than 4 PLEGs in most instances. A VeraLite simply wouldn't be able to handle it due to the limited memory in these units and the minimum memory footprint of each PLEG device. In theory, one could do everything they want in one PLEG device. Multiple PLEGs are more for organizational and isolation purposes. Many of us use the best practice of dividing our HA functions by a PLEG, ie, all lighting control in one PLEG, HVAC/environmental control in another, Security control in another. That leaves you one more PLEG for "miscellaneous". I'm sure Richard didn't simply pick the number 4 out of thin air. If you have a full Vera3 unit, then yes, you could get away with having more than 4 PLEG devices without possibly consuming all your memory. If that's you, then go for it and buy the extra license.

If you're not a programmer, then you have no idea how much effort and hours, days, weeks and months go into developing a program that will be used by the public. You have to spend hours investigating every possible use case and bug that is reported. It's obvious Richard constantly updates and maintains this program, even when it was free. The man deserves to be compensated, he's worked hard for that right. It makes absolutely zero difference whether the program was free before or not, many open source or fee-free projects eventually go to a paid support or commercial version model.

And finally, as Richard previously alluded to, it's a free market. Just as one doesn't have to buy a car, they can simply take free or public transportation. Both will get you from point A to point B. But you will more than likely enjoy the ride better in the car. Try doing anything useful with your Vera without PLEG. If you're a programmer you can do it, but if you're not, have fun while you write and debug LUA code. The fact a plugin like PLEG even has to exist is because MCV put out a half-baked product.

I for one think he's charging too little given the fact a Vera can't even do conditional statements right out of the box, which to me is a joke given the sophistication one needs to competently do home automation. Again, blame MCV for putting out a half-baked product.

</soapbox>

-TC

Offline hamishb

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Re: License for PLEG and PLTS Plugins (Starting April 1, 2014)
« Reply #42 on: February 28, 2014, 10:01:44 pm »
Thanks - just bought two.

My PayPal email address is not my Google account address so interested to see which email account gets registered!

Offline parkerc

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Re: License for PLEG and PLTS Plugins (Starting April 1, 2014)
« Reply #43 on: March 01, 2014, 03:05:02 am »
I think it's safe to say that no one can disagree with someone's desire to recover some money for the time and effort they've put in to develop something that's felt to be of considerable use/value to others .

However while I'm not a programmer,  I do still like to learn little bits here and there about Luup, but I've also lost count of the number of times people have responded to a Luup question I've raised, with "you should use PLEG"

PLEG is a great example of what Vera's own in-house programmers did not or could not do.

But  please do continue to support  those of us still interested in learning about Luup on the side (if thats we want to do). :)

« Last Edit: March 01, 2014, 04:05:36 am by parkerc »

Offline bucko

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Re: License for PLEG and PLTS Plugins (Starting April 1, 2014)
« Reply #44 on: March 01, 2014, 03:19:14 am »
Hi Richard,

I'm running PLEG ver 5.8. I do not see a registration place anywhere.

I want to stay on 5.8 until 6 has all the kinks worked out.

I also want to register my vera 3 ID 30101824.

Please let me know what I can do at this point. I also do not want to lose all my configs. I've backed up so I assume I am safe.

Thanks for the great work.

Vera 3, 40+ Fibaro relays & dimmers, IPUX cams, Elk M1 Gold, M1XEP, M1SP, XVOR, M1RB, Elk124, Monoprice HDMI matrix & 6 zone amp, Denon AVR, Panasonic A8000, BI DV,On Controls