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Author Topic: Need help installing Trane thermostat  (Read 29435 times)

Offline GoingGreen

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Re: Need help installing Trane thermostat
« Reply #45 on: May 15, 2014, 10:00:28 pm »
I lose concentration after a while and that is the only explanation I can offer for my inappropriate suggestion to jumper 24RC (hot) and 24C (common). I do understand this would be exactly the wrong thing to do. Sorry for the lapse.

Beginning to wonder if it is possible to talk by phone. That might be faster. I don't have a calling plan that lets me make long distance, but I do have Skype and Google Talk. Maybe a Google hangout would work.

I cannot test the multimeter by inserting the probes into a household socket. The probes are too tiny, only about 1/8 inch is exposed.

I did replace the original manufacturers 9 V battery with a Duracell, but see no change because of that. I did probe the connections on the relay in the air handler and get essentially the same result as probing the 24RC to 24C at the thermostat connection block. With the meter set to 20 V resolution I see about 0.05-0.07 and the reading is not steady. This is a digital multi meter.

Offline integlikewhoa

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Re: Need help installing Trane thermostat
« Reply #46 on: May 15, 2014, 10:52:57 pm »
I lose concentration after a while and that is the only explanation I can offer for my inappropriate suggestion to jumper 24RC (hot) and 24C (common). I do understand this would be exactly the wrong thing to do. Sorry for the lapse.

Beginning to wonder if it is possible to talk by phone. That might be faster. I don't have a calling plan that lets me make long distance, but I do have Skype and Google Talk. Maybe a Google hangout would work.

I cannot test the multimeter by inserting the probes into a household socket. The probes are too tiny, only about 1/8 inch is exposed.

I did replace the original manufacturers 9 V battery with a Duracell, but see no change because of that. I did probe the connections on the relay in the air handler and get essentially the same result as probing the 24RC to 24C at the thermostat connection block. With the meter set to 20 V resolution I see about 0.05-0.07 and the reading is not steady. This is a digital multi meter.

I feel you are not properly using the meter and I would skip the meter for now and test the thermostat. As long as blue and red not on the same circuit you can little to no harm.

Connect the 3 blues, verify the 3 reds and on the thermostat that blue is to C and red is RC or RH and put thermostat on. Power up system and thermostat should light up.


Offline GoingGreen

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Re: Need help installing Trane thermostat
« Reply #47 on: May 16, 2014, 02:45:07 pm »
Progress. Installed the thermostat on the mounting bracket. It powers up. Set the clock and tested the fan. Checks OK.

The next checkout was to  check cooling operation. Set the temp 10 degrees below room reading and after several minutes am not getting any cool air. The white wire we left disconnected in the air handler is still that way, recall.

Unfortunately, I have to break off now to leave for my appointment at cardio rehab. Will be back in a few hours and check to see what advice you offer now.

The instructions call for checking heating next. Then I have to enroll the device in the Vera system.

Just reviewed instructions and see I missed the 18c installer instructions. This is how you designate heat pump operation. If I understood the instructions, I have a single stage system so this is how I configured the control.

In a few minutes the fan stopped. After several minutes the fan started again. The display says Cool is on, but I do not feel cool air from the registers. I went outside to check the compressor and saw it kick on and then go off.

Since I have to leave for a few hours I thought it best to just kill the power until I get back and see what you have to say.


Offline integlikewhoa

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Re: Need help installing Trane thermostat
« Reply #48 on: May 16, 2014, 03:12:15 pm »
Progress. Installed the thermostat on the mounting bracket. It powers up. Set the clock and tested the fan. Checks OK.
That's good news. Shows the wiring diagram is right and we are moving in a positive direction. Also shows your multimeter readings are not correct (we might need to get that fixed before we can test anything else). I suggest you set your multimeter up like your ready to test for 24v then post a picture of the meter (and connections) so we can verify you have the meter in the right setting and the leads (wires) in the right place.

The next checkout was to  check cooling operation. Set the temp 10 degrees below room reading and after several minutes am not getting any cool air. The white wire we left disconnected in the air handler is still that way, recall.
White wire is ok for now, we haven't forgot. Compressor should be running and you should get hot or cold air with the white wire off. White wire is connected to a valve that reverses the flow in the outside a/c unit. With it disconnected (no power) we are trying to find out which way its going, then we will know if power on white wire means cool or if power on means heat. At this point without a model number off the outside unit and without pictures of the wiring in the outside unit we have to rely on testing the wire manually to figure it out.

I personally am better at wiring diagrams and your multimeter testing seems to be off for now, so if it's not to much trouble I would feel more comfortable with the model number and pictures of wiring in outside unit then I could set this straight without having to test so many wires to guess whats going on.

If you choose to check out the wiring of the outside unit, please make sure power is turned off to that unit. It should have 240v disconnect within a few feet of the unit. Shut it off there before working on that. We will not need to touch anything on the 240v side but don't want any problems.

The instructions call for checking heating next. Then I have to enroll the device in the Vera system.
You can check for heat and let us know the results, and I wouldn't bother with VERA just yet. It's not needed and we in the middle on just getting everything to work right first.

Just reviewed instructions and see I missed the 18c installer instructions. This is how you designate heat pump operation. If I understood the instructions, I have a single stage system so this is how I configured the control.
I would before any more testing go threw and adjust settings to match your system. If the thermostat thinks you have more then one stage or have a heater rather then a heatpump it can send false info out to wires (2nd stage) that are not even hooked up there for it thinks it cooling in 2nd stage or 3rd stage but you don't have that and there for nothing is really happening.

So please set the following in the mechanical settings (should be page 27 of the manual)
Type: Heatpump
Fan Type: Electric
C/O type: unknown for now. (white reversing wire)
2nd stage heat: NO
Aux heat: NO
2nd stage cooling: NO

In a few minutes the fan stopped. After several minutes the fan started again. The display says Cool is on, but I do not feel cool air from the registers. I went outside to check the compressor and saw it kick on and then go off.
Unsure why it would kick on and off at this point, need more info.

« Last Edit: May 16, 2014, 03:27:45 pm by integlikewhoa »

Offline GoingGreen

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Re: Need help installing Trane thermostat
« Reply #49 on: May 16, 2014, 09:14:52 pm »

You Write:
So please set the following in the mechanical settings (should be page 27 of the manual)
Type: Heatpump
Fan Type: Electric
C/O type: unknown for now. (white reversing wire)
2nd stage heat: NO
Aux heat: NO
2nd stage cooling: NO

Rechecked and this is current condition. It agrees with step 18c, of my installation instructions which is what I followed. I don't have a manual, but would be nice to locate one. The installation crew left me with with nothing.

I'll take some photos of the outside unit when it gets a bit cooler. Right now it is 106 degrees, late in the day and I am getting tired and hungry. It looks as though I'll have to remove a sheet metal panel to gain access to the internal wiring connections. I have located the main circuit breaker for the unit.

As far as the multimeter, will attach a photo of it as well. It is a Southwire model sold by Lowes.

So I am beginning to think I may have blown the fuse in the air handler. I may have gotten confused at one time or another and thought the circuit breaker was off outside when it was in fact on. We went through many gyrations over the past days. It is a simple matter to check the fuse, so will do that in the morning when I am starting fresh.

Maintenance work and troubleshooting inevitably involves risk of causing problems as you are probably well aware.

Another option is just to call an AC mechanic and since the outside unit is due for a check and cleaning, perhaps that is the way to go. Maybe if I order a regular checkup/cleaning they can make me a deal on the service call.

Otherwise, I am content to keep working on the issue a few more days. Perhaps we just need a fuse, which is considerably cheaper than a service call.

The heat pump is a Trane XR13, manufactured 1/2011. 4TWR3048A1000AB

Offline integlikewhoa

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Re: Need help installing Trane thermostat
« Reply #50 on: May 16, 2014, 10:26:59 pm »
The picture you posted is checking DC voltage. DC has the straight line after the "V" AC has the wavey line.

Spin it to the right 2 clicks after the "OFF" to "200 V~" and then test your red and blue wires.   
« Last Edit: May 16, 2014, 10:29:14 pm by integlikewhoa »

Offline integlikewhoa

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Re: Need help installing Trane thermostat
« Reply #51 on: May 16, 2014, 10:37:50 pm »
I don't have a manual, but would be nice to locate one. The installation crew left me with with nothing.
The manual I was referring to was for the TRANE Z-wave thermostat.
I have already posted your air handler manual on the 2 or 3 page of this thread and I'll post you A/C manual in a bit since i have the info on it below.

I'll take some photos of the outside unit when it gets a bit cooler. Right now it is 106 degrees, late in the day and I am getting tired and hungry. It looks as though I'll have to remove a sheet metal panel to gain access to the internal wiring connections. I have located the main circuit breaker for the unit.
Yes there should be 1 or 2 small 1/4" screws you remove and the panel will slide off. You should find a disconnect on a few feet away from the unit. It's code now a days.

As far as the multimeter, will attach a photo of it as well. It is a Southwire model sold by Lowes.

So I am beginning to think I may have blown the fuse in the air handler. I may have gotten confused at one time or another and thought the circuit breaker was off outside when it was in fact on. We went through many gyrations over the past days. It is a simple matter to check the fuse, so will do that in the morning when I am starting fresh.


Already commented on that problem. And we know the fuse is good in the air handler because the thermostat powers up and the fan blows. Neither would work if that fuse was blown. You have power, you just didn't know it.

Maintenance work and troubleshooting inevitably involves risk of causing problems as you are probably well aware.

Another option is just to call an AC mechanic and since the outside unit is due for a check and cleaning, perhaps that is the way to go. Maybe if I order a regular checkup/cleaning they can make me a deal on the service call.

Otherwise, I am content to keep working on the issue a few more days. Perhaps we just need a fuse, which is considerably cheaper than a service call.
[/quote] We are almost done and you haven't burnt the house down. Most important we are all learning something.

The heat pump is a Trane XR13, manufactured 1/2011. 4TWR3048A1000AB

I'll post up the manual in a few min., but I will wait on really making any wiring moves until I see what they have going on. Post 1 or 2 good pictures like you did in the air handler

EDIT: Here's where you can find you manual for the outside unit. http://dar.proflo.com/darmanager/Query?PRODUCT_ID=4131361&USE_TYPE=INSTALLATION
And I have attached a picture of the wiring diagram.
« Last Edit: May 16, 2014, 10:43:03 pm by integlikewhoa »

Offline GoingGreen

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Re: Need help installing Trane thermostat
« Reply #52 on: May 17, 2014, 04:38:29 am »
Yes, agree, the fuse must be OK. Disregard my comment. I really should not try to work late in the day.

Offline GoingGreen

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Re: Need help installing Trane thermostat
« Reply #53 on: May 17, 2014, 01:58:44 pm »
OK mystery solved with the multimeter. Switching function as you suggested results in a reading of 26.9 V. A bit high. I think I was interpreting the function I was trying to use as Volts RMS, but looking closer at the meter it is impossible to decipher the actual legend on the meter.

Offline GoingGreen

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Re: Need help installing Trane thermostat
« Reply #54 on: May 17, 2014, 02:07:28 pm »
Here are photos of heat pump cover and main power control.

So, I'll kill power and remove the panel at the bottom and take some more photos.

Offline GoingGreen

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Re: Need help installing Trane thermostat
« Reply #55 on: May 17, 2014, 02:49:42 pm »
Photo attached.

Orange to white
Red to red
Blue to blue
Yellow to yellow
Black - open
Green open

« Last Edit: May 17, 2014, 03:27:00 pm by GoingGreen »

Offline GoingGreen

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Re: Need help installing Trane thermostat
« Reply #56 on: May 17, 2014, 02:59:32 pm »
I don't know how to interpret the "field hookup diagram" but assume the version on the left is what we should be following. Awaiting further instructions, because it is clear you will know.

Offline GoingGreen

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Re: Need help installing Trane thermostat
« Reply #57 on: May 17, 2014, 03:16:39 pm »
Found the heat pump manual. This is interesting.

"F.   COMPReSSOR START UP
After all electrical wiring is complete, SET THE THER- MOSTAT SYSTEM SWITCH IN THE OFF POSITION SO
COMPRESSOR WILL NOT RUN, and apply power by clos- ing the system main disconnect switch. This will activate the compressor sump heat (where used). Do not change the Thermostat System Switch until power has been applied for one (1) hour. Following this procedure will prevent potential compressor overload trip at the initial start-up."



Offline RichardTSchaefer

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Re: Need help installing Trane thermostat
« Reply #58 on: May 18, 2014, 08:48:05 am »
That's for VERY COLD conditions (heat pumps where the outside temp drops very low at night than warms up enough to be used ... The OIL in the compressor can get COLD soaked ... and you have a crankcase heater to warm the oil.

In your case (you indicated > 100 deg in a previous post) you do not have to worry about that ... but I did mention 5 minutes between stopping the compressor and trying to start it again.


Offline RichardTSchaefer

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Re: Need help installing Trane thermostat
« Reply #59 on: May 18, 2014, 08:55:42 am »
Since we know that Red - 24V Hot and Blue is 24V Common, 
I believe:
    Yellow causes the compressor to come on.
    White controls Heat/Cool mode for the Heat Pump.
And as @integlikewhoa guessed ... the green wire is not connected to anything.


So if the thermostat has been off for a while ... and then you turn it on and request cooling ... the compressor should come on ... We just do not know about cool or heat mode (because the white wire at the air-handler side is still disconnected). Can you verify the Compressor comes on ?  Does it stop shortly after that ? How long ?