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Author Topic: "Associations"  (Read 2278 times)

Offline clippermiami

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"Associations"
« on: November 26, 2014, 10:15:38 am »
I've never really been clear about how to make proper use of the "associations" function.

For example I have two lights in the Garage; the Garage Lights and the Laundry Lights. Each is connected to a GE/Jasco On/Off switch. The door to the Garage from the house has a door/window sensor and using PLEG is configured to turn on both lights when the door is opened. This works but the Laundry Light usually comes on several seconds after the Garage Light.

So lets say I wanted to make them work at the same time. Would "associating" the two Light Switches make them behave as a couple  and go on together instead of one after the other? Should they be associated with the Door Sensor?

Thanks.
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Offline RexBeckett

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Re: "Associations"
« Reply #1 on: November 26, 2014, 12:42:44 pm »
Quote
This works but the Laundry Light usually comes on several seconds after the Garage Light.

Assuming that the actions are sent at the same time (i.e. with no deliberate delay), this is probably because the Laundry light requires retries before it gets the command. That would show in the log. Running a heal on the light might help.

Quote
So lets say I wanted to make them work at the same time. Would "associating" the two Light Switches make them behave as a couple  and go on together instead of one after the other?

If the Garage light has a better Z-Wave path to Vera and is reasonably close to the Laundry light, it might conceivably help to associate them using Garage as master and Laundry as slave.

Quote
Should they be associated with the Door Sensor?

You could do that but there is no possibility of introducing any delays or conditions. The lights would go on when the door is open and go off when it is closed.

Offline clippermiami

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Re: "Associations"
« Reply #2 on: November 26, 2014, 12:48:25 pm »
Quote
This works but the Laundry Light usually comes on several seconds after the Garage Light.

Assuming that the actions are sent at the same time (i.e. with no deliberate delay), this is probably because the Laundry light requires retries before it gets the command. That would show in the log. Running a heal on the light might help.

Quote
So lets say I wanted to make them work at the same time. Would "associating" the two Light Switches make them behave as a couple  and go on together instead of one after the other?

If the Garage light has a better Z-Wave path to Vera and is reasonably close to the Laundry light, it might conceivably help to associate them using Garage as master and Laundry as slave.

Quote
Should they be associated with the Door Sensor?

You could do that but there is no possibility of introducing any delays or conditions. The lights would go on when the door is open and go off when it is closed.

So the principle  is that associate devices will communicate directly among themselves without going through Vera?i.e. a device activated by Vera will communicate that fact directly to all of its associated devices? There is then no need to include the "slave" devices in any Vera operation?

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Offline RexBeckett

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Re: "Associations"
« Reply #3 on: November 26, 2014, 12:58:50 pm »
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So the principle  is that associate devices will communicate directly among themselves without going through Vera?

Correct. You use Vera to set up the association but from that point the master sends Z-Wave commands directly to the slave. This will continue to work even if Vera is offline.

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i.e. a device activated by Vera will communicate that fact directly to all of its associated devices?

To be honest, I have not tried that. I think it would work like that.

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There is then no need to include the "slave" devices in any Vera operation?

See above. If the association still works when activated by Z-Wave rather than the local switch then you would not need Vera to send commands to the slaves.

Note: Unless your switches support instant-status reporting, Vera may not see the changed states until it next polls the device. This may affect your scenes or PLEG logic.

Offline clippermiami

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Re: "Associations"
« Reply #4 on: November 26, 2014, 01:11:37 pm »
Rex,

I can see a potential problem, all my switches are GE/Jasco that don't support Instant Update.. The best I could do then is set the poll interval to ONE second but of course that's no guarantee.


Thanks for the explanation thought, I think I grasp the principle now.

John
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Offline TC1

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Re: "Associations"
« Reply #5 on: November 26, 2014, 01:27:38 pm »
Rex,

I can see a potential problem, all my switches are GE/Jasco that don't support Instant Update.. The best I could do then is set the poll interval to ONE second but of course that's no guarantee.


Thanks for the explanation thought, I think I grasp the principle now.

John

Also, I believe GE/Jasco stuff don't support associations either.

This is one reason I pay slightly more for Cooper stuff, associations, instant status, and some other features (min/max brightness, ramp rates, etc).

Offline clippermiami

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Re: "Associations"
« Reply #6 on: November 26, 2014, 01:40:11 pm »
Rex,

I can see a potential problem, all my switches are GE/Jasco that don't support Instant Update.. The best I could do then is set the poll interval to ONE second but of course that's no guarantee.


Thanks for the explanation thought, I think I grasp the principle now.

John

Also, I believe GE/Jasco stuff don't support associations either.

This is one reason I pay slightly more for Cooper stuff, associations, instant status, and some other features (min/max brightness, ramp rates, etc).

There is a field for Associations in the GE/Jasco switches. I suppose its possible they don't actually, I've never tried them.
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Offline TC1

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Re: "Associations"
« Reply #7 on: November 26, 2014, 01:45:55 pm »
I noticed that too. I do in fact have GE switches for locations where I don't need dimming. I'm going to try an association see if it works. If so, will save me a little bit of money, but the fact is I don't pay too much more for the Coopers ($55 - $59) since I found a local electrical supply house that wholesales them and simply drop ships them to me from Cooper.