Author Topic: No further development on existing Nest plugin  (Read 3808 times)

Offline watou

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No further development on existing Nest plugin
« on: April 14, 2015, 08:28:22 pm »
Hello all,

There will not be another release of the Nest plugin that I have been evolving since 2012.  With the new firmware and with no advanced notice to me, Vera has obsoleted the existing plugin by writing their own. 

Since last year I have been trying to get a better answer to the UI7 problems than "you just can't make a thermostat plugin look correct on UI7 as it did on UI5."  So instead of empowering this plugin developer with the full tools and documentation to meet this very long-standing need, they simply stepped right over the external developer with their own (closed) integration.

Maybe this will be good for users, maybe not.  I do know that a number of useful telemetry values cannot be available with the Vera integration, such as battery percentage, precise temperatures and humidity values, what equipment is currently running, and a lot more.  Existing plugin users will likely notice the loss of information and function.

I also know, as a plugin developer who worked very hard since 2012 to make the best plugin that was possible, that this is just one more disincentive for external developers to spend their precious time and resources adding to the platform.  It is certainly Vera's right to do this, just as it's my right to return to the market for other solutions.

All the best,
watou

P.S. Site administrator, please find a new moderator for the Nest sub-forum.  I am unlikely to play that role well in future.


Offline integlikewhoa

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Re: No further development on existing Nest plugin
« Reply #1 on: April 14, 2015, 08:57:44 pm »
Hello all,

There will not be another release of the Nest plugin that I have been evolving since 2012.  With the new firmware and with no advanced notice to me, Vera has obsoleted the existing plugin by writing their own. 

Since last year I have been trying to get a better answer to the UI7 problems than "you just can't make a thermostat plugin look correct on UI7 as it did on UI5."  So instead of empowering this plugin developer with the full tools and documentation to meet this very long-standing need, they simply stepped right over the external developer with their own (closed) integration.

Maybe this will be good for users, maybe not.  I do know that a number of useful telemetry values cannot be available with the Vera integration, such as battery percentage, precise temperatures and humidity values, what equipment is currently running, and a lot more.  Existing plugin users will likely notice the loss of information and function.

I also know, as a plugin developer who worked very hard since 2012 to make the best plugin that was possible, that this is just one more disincentive for external developers to spend their precious time and resources adding to the platform.  It is certainly Vera's right to do this, just as it's my right to return to the market for other solutions.

All the best,
watou

P.S. Site administrator, please find a new moderator for the Nest sub-forum.  I am unlikely to play that role well in future.

Sorry to here your disappointment and we know VERA has had a bad working relationship with the plugin developers.

It's alot of work you have put in and even tho I never used this plugin we appreciate what you have done.

With that said if VERA really takes over and continues with development on this I can't see it as a bad thing (assuming they don't screw it up). Its good to unload some of the duties of the developers onto VERA themselves. 

Offline hmspain

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Re: No further development on existing Nest plugin
« Reply #2 on: April 14, 2015, 11:03:29 pm »
You did your best, it was all anyone could ask.
VeraPlus (1); Cameras (6), Sirens (2), Hue Bulbs/Strips/Blooms (42), Fan Dimmer (6), Aeon 4-in-1s (10), Water Sensors (3), Z-Wave Switches (20), Nest Smoke/CO Protects (5), Nest Thermostat Gen3 (1), HEM Gen2s (2)

Offline TC1

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Re: No further development on existing Nest plugin
« Reply #3 on: April 14, 2015, 11:12:35 pm »
Quote
Maybe this will be good for users, maybe not.  I do know that a number of useful telemetry values cannot be available with the Vera integration, such as battery percentage, precise temperatures and humidity values, what equipment is currently running, and a lot more.  Existing plugin users will likely notice the loss of information and function.

Umm... I don't call this a win when the users lose functionality.

Sorry to see you go watou, but can't blame you. MCV continues to stumble, I guess their so-called effort of open communication with the devs was short lived. The writing is on the wall and I won't be investing in a newer Vera model, too much uncertainty as to what will be supported with several plug-in devs discontinuing further efforts.

Hopefully someone from MCV is reading this gets the wake-up message (for the thousandth time).

Offline futzle

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Re: No further development on existing Nest plugin
« Reply #4 on: April 14, 2015, 11:32:18 pm »
Advisory: Sarcasm is not directed at anyone who has contributed to this thread.

I always DREAMED of being snubbed so publicly by GetVera. I've even got a ton of no-longer-updated plugins that users are struggling to make work on the latest Vera Edge firmware, so if we are talking about incentive, I've given the developers at GetVera plenty. But instead they re-implement a plugin that _was_ working. Talk about priorities.

(Closed-source the new plugin is, you say? Hope they did a proper clean-room implementation and didn't refer to watou's code at all. It'd be embarrassing for another open source licence violation to happen to them.)

Offline Ramias

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Re: No further development on existing Nest plugin
« Reply #5 on: April 17, 2015, 10:59:39 am »
I'm incredibly grateful to you and the other developers who have spent unpaid time in making things that make my home automation hobby more enjoyable.

So thank you for that you've been doing with this.

I saw Nest mentioned in the release notes for the latest FW but haven't seen anything else on it so not sure what it is technically they did (though agree they should have spoken with you first).

Offline dsroberts1945

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Re: No further development on existing Nest plugin
« Reply #6 on: April 17, 2015, 02:50:44 pm »
Sorry to see you go Watou, I've used the Nest plugin since the beginning and it's been very useful.


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Offline RoChess

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Re: No further development on existing Nest plugin
« Reply #7 on: April 17, 2015, 03:05:28 pm »
@watou, your plugin was the reason I bought a Vera3 to begin with, as the HomeGenie open-source Home Automation software had no support for Nest.

Thank you for your efforts. Even if I never got to experience your plugin in its full UI5 glory, it still did the job on UI7 for me to get the cost saving results I was after.

Guess I will have to adjust my priorities to get Nest support added to the HomeGenie open-source software/hardware project. Not sure if you might be inclined that route yourself. The only 'change' perhaps needed is to the UI code, but HomeGenie uses a simple model for that with tons of examples on the GitHub project site. The lead creator/developer "Gene" is also active on their forum.

Revenge is a dish best served cold :)

Offline watou

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Re: No further development on existing Nest plugin
« Reply #8 on: April 17, 2015, 04:54:56 pm »
Thanks for the kind words; they are appreciated.  And @futzle, you're great and very sensible.  I have no animosity, just a deepened indifference.  Plus I've been hacking away in OpenHAB land, where all the source is open and anything is possible.  (YMMV.)

watou

Offline RoChess

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Re: No further development on existing Nest plugin
« Reply #9 on: April 17, 2015, 06:24:46 pm »
Plus I've been hacking away in OpenHAB land, where all the source is open and anything is possible.  (YMMV.)

OpenHAB looks very interesting, so will give them a try once 1.7 is released as I want Nest support from the start. The only unknown is if they support Schlage deadbolts, as those rely on the Z-Wave security command classes that not all software solutions support.


Offline newbneedshelp

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Re: No further development on existing Nest plugin
« Reply #10 on: April 19, 2015, 03:50:56 pm »

With that said if VERA really takes over and continues with development on this I can't see it as a bad thing (assuming they don't screw it up). Its good to unload some of the duties of the developers onto VERA themselves.
[/quote]
Regrettably VERA is trying to kill itself by alienating developers. The UI5 was flaky, but it still is infinitely better than UI7. After a year of struggling with even basic functionality and useability of UI7 I finally reverted to UI5. Just a small example: on UI5 I can see and operate 17 devices on single screen without scrolling' in UI7 I can see at most 3 device and in order to do anything I must scroll and scroll and scroll some more.... and then a little more scrolling.
The Romanian Vera friends were great in repairing what needed to be fixed in UI5 setting in post UI7 Vera3 - and I am finally seeing my devices and can use many apps the great developers wrote. But I see no movement in Vera to get anything improved.
There is no past experience that would justify the hope that if Vera takes alienates developers any further - that there is any reason to stay with it.
The great potential of an independent of-cloud control is slowly disappearing.
Vera 3 UI v.5 (downgraded fromv.7)
Kwikset lock, 2 x Aeon HEM e1 2-phase, Insteon/X10, Trane Thermostat, 2 x Panasonic cams, bunch of in walll relays(some even work).

Offline rstrouse

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Re: No further development on existing Nest plugin
« Reply #11 on: April 19, 2015, 07:41:57 pm »
I hear you about all the scrolling.  That's why Virtual Panel exists.  I get more in a single panel than can be done on an any of the UIs.
1xVera3 1.7.619, 4xLinear WT00Z, 3xLinear WS15Z, 1xLeviton VRCZ4, 10xCooper RF9540, 1xLeviton VRFI10, 1xLeviton VP00R, 2xLinear GD00Z-4, 1xGE/Jasco 45612, 1xGE/Jasco 45610,  4xGE/Jasco 45605, 2xYale YRD220-ZW-619, 1xCaddx NX584, Autelis Intellitouch Pool Control, OpenSprinkler

Offline BOFH

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Re: No further development on existing Nest plugin
« Reply #12 on: April 19, 2015, 07:56:58 pm »
Virtual Panels rock! They are the main reason I am starting to move devices from my UI5 Vera3 to my Ui7 Vera3. So I can create panels for display and control. At this time only various sensors are on the UI7 unit and rather than scrolling down to view them all, they are in a panel where at a quick glance I can see if they are tripped or not. Well, until I upgraded to the latest UUI7 incarnation. As most of them no longer untrip.

Can't wait for rstrouse to start supporting camera's as I checked several of my Android tablet and they can display my Vera's dashboard quite well. So I'll have panels until Vera hopefully builds in support for them in the Vera app. Or Imperihome does...   
Vera3 UI5 UI7 Edge Plus
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