Author Topic: Nightmare Setting Association for a Multi-Channel Device  (Read 1822 times)

Offline Tillsy

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Re: Nightmare Setting Association for a Multi-Channel Device
« Reply #15 on: February 26, 2018, 06:09:04 am »
Alrighty how do I explain this.

So I have a setting on my Fibaro relays that basically turns them off after a certain amount of time.  For the passageway this is quite short as I only need them on for a really short duration.

The trouble is, yes the Vera does react very quickly to detecting things - but its speed with setting things is abysmal.  For example if I turn a light on manually Vera instantly knows this - but if I have Vera turn a light on it can sit there for quite a while, often retrying, sometimes a couple of times, and then succeeds.  The dumb thing is that what it wants to do happens instantly (e.g. turn on a light) but it takes a long time to realise this worked - yet it gets the feedback instantly when I do it myself?

Anyways setting up a scene caused a total and utter meltdown.  The scene was triggered, Vera tried to turn on the light (which it did but Vera didn't know), she sat there for ages, she retried, she sat there, but then the relay auto turned off, and then Vera retried a second time... so the light went on, it went off, it went on... then of course the sensor also timed out and turned off.  Seems simple, but when I walked down that passage several times the whole system ended up going into total and utter meltdown.

I've had to turn off the option in the Fibaros to auto turn off.  This was painful as all the devices went into non-responsive state, even after I power cycled EVERYTHING... so after all the hell I've had with all this Z-Wave compatibility, with Vera, the whole thing, I was ready to take the thing into the street and belt it with a hammer.  I'm really very frustrated with this whole thing... right from the start when the Vera bricked itself straight out the box.  Anyways I instead walked away and put my daughters to bed.  Came back half hour later and everything had finally configured and gone back to normal.

So I'v now re-set up the scene.  The response time is shocking - well sometimes it is almost instant, sometimes there's a huge delay, and likewise with turning it off - but it works.  It's unusable - passage is only a few metres so all this crap happens after you have already traversed the darkness, but it works.

Now I know what you're thinking - you have reception problems causing these Z-wave comms issues.  Negative - this particular relay is a whopping 3m from the Vera.  Nothing in-between.  The other relays are about 4m from the Vera, one wall between those.  And don't forget if I flip the light switch manually, over and over and over and over, the Vera INSTANTLY acknowledges this... every time.  The problem is only when the Vera instructs this - the action occurs instantly but Vera struggles to get feedback.

Completely off topic, but hopefully someone might have an answer why that is.  I have polling off, it seemed a waste of precious Z-Wave traffic when I strictly use Z-Wave Plus devices which are meant to provide instant feedback without polling, but maybe I need to turn that on... but then again to solve this issue it would need to be polling every few seconds which is a really really bad idea.

In any case this sensor is useless anyway as it only has a range of 3m and, more importantly, a shockingly poor angle of vision... so it doesn't even see you until you're almost under it.  Compared to the 20+ year old security PIRs I have about the house which can see you from opposite end of the house, seriously.  I think I'm going to have to give up on the MultiSensor and do it myself via the Z-UNO.

Offline Tillsy

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Re: Nightmare Setting Association for a Multi-Channel Device
« Reply #16 on: February 26, 2018, 06:10:28 am »
Sampling a bunch of different motion sensors on the z-wave alliance website (which lists what devices supports what command classes) looks like the Fibaro is essentially the only motion sensor on the market that supports multi-channel.  Zipato, Everspring, Aeotec, Jasco, Homeseer, none of them support Multi-Channel.
Seriously mate thanks so much for going to so much effort researching that, it's very interesting information.  It really is a shame that Fibaro doesn't support being powered externally

Offline therealdb

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Re: Nightmare Setting Association for a Multi-Channel Device
« Reply #17 on: February 26, 2018, 05:02:16 pm »
Alrighty how do I explain this.

So I have a setting on my Fibaro relays that basically turns them off after a certain amount of time.  For the passageway this is quite short as I only need them on for a really short duration.

The trouble is, yes the Vera does react very quickly to detecting things - but its speed with setting things is abysmal.  For example if I turn a light on manually Vera instantly knows this - but if I have Vera turn a light on it can sit there for quite a while, often retrying, sometimes a couple of times, and then succeeds.  The dumb thing is that what it wants to do happens instantly (e.g. turn on a light) but it takes a long time to realise this worked - yet it gets the feedback instantly when I do it myself?

Are you using Fibaro fgs 223? Because I filed a ticket with your exact behavior and the support told me it's under investigation. So, it's like a bug in their implementation. Technically speaking, the message is sent, but the zwave response is not recognized from the Vera, so they try again and 2-3 times later it succeed.

If you want maximum flexibility go for Fibaro universal sensor. I love mine. I have two mapped to my alarm panel and external sensors for mailbox and gate.
Vera Edge EU, Fibaro FGRM 222 (12), Fibaro FGS 223 (20), Fibaro FGS 222 (5), Fibaro Universal Binary Sensor (2), Fibaro Plug (3), NeoCoolCam Door Sensor (3), NeoCoolCam PIR (2), Nest (3), Home Server running my own integrations, Harmony Hub, OpenSprinkler, Personal Weather Station, Sonoff TH & more

Offline Tillsy

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Re: Nightmare Setting Association for a Multi-Channel Device
« Reply #18 on: February 26, 2018, 05:51:33 pm »
Are you using Fibaro fgs 223? Because I filed a ticket with your exact behavior and the support told me it's under investigation. So, it's like a bug in their implementation. Technically speaking, the message is sent, but the zwave response is not recognized from the Vera, so they try again and 2-3 times later it succeed.
Yes, Fibaro FGS-223 - a lot of them.  They all do the same thing:
1. Turn them on or off via manual light switch - "instantly" changes status on Vera.  Every time.  Without fail.
2. Turn them on or off via Vera - "instantly" happens, but Vera then sits there saying it is retrying... repeatedly.  Generally within 10 seconds it will then acknowledge the lights are on or off, sometimes the Vera will assume it didn't work and revert its status (so lights are ON but Vera says they are OFF), and other times Vera will send an inverse command to turn the light back off or on again (and whole process repeats).

So you appear to be dead right - the Vera DOES happily talk with the FGS-223 because it can instantly turn devices on and off, the FGS-223 happily talks to the Vera because the Vera instantly shows status changes if they happen at Fibaro end, but if the Vera turns something on it seems to not properly understand the response sent back from the Fibaro.

Am I able to contribute to your ticket to help re-enforce the problem, or should I log another ticket, or we just leave it because they may hopefully be already on it?

Offline zedrally

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Re: Nightmare Setting Association for a Multi-Channel Device
« Reply #19 on: February 26, 2018, 06:02:06 pm »
^^^
Never leave it.
IMO, The more tickets that are open on a particular device the better.
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Offline Tillsy

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Re: Nightmare Setting Association for a Multi-Channel Device
« Reply #20 on: February 26, 2018, 06:44:13 pm »
Okay ticket submitted - albeit it didn't give me a ticket number back on the website nor have I received an automated email yet...

Offline Tillsy

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Re: Nightmare Setting Association for a Multi-Channel Device
« Reply #21 on: February 26, 2018, 10:05:45 pm »
I also submitted a ticket to Aeotec yesterday about the MultiSensor 6 not handling endpoints for a Multichannel node.

They have got back to me today advising they will do tests with two of their own multichannel devices (Dual Nano Switch & 4-way Smart Power Strip) and get back to me in a few days.

Offline therealdb

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Re: Nightmare Setting Association for a Multi-Channel Device
« Reply #22 on: February 27, 2018, 12:13:30 pm »
Am I able to contribute to your ticket to help re-enforce the problem, or should I log another ticket, or we just leave it because they may hopefully be already on it?

yeah, same situation. just file a ticket and they'll link all them to their internal bug system.

I have the same exact behavior and I sent them part of the logs. It's something related to encrypted messages not always handled correctly. So the zwave message is received, the light is turned on instantly, but the Vera thinks it's not - so if you push the switch, the lights will come off - and on again. very frustrating, but I like my FGS 223 (because of their potential) and I really hope they will eventually fix them.
Vera Edge EU, Fibaro FGRM 222 (12), Fibaro FGS 223 (20), Fibaro FGS 222 (5), Fibaro Universal Binary Sensor (2), Fibaro Plug (3), NeoCoolCam Door Sensor (3), NeoCoolCam PIR (2), Nest (3), Home Server running my own integrations, Harmony Hub, OpenSprinkler, Personal Weather Station, Sonoff TH & more

Offline Tillsy

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Re: Nightmare Setting Association for a Multi-Channel Device
« Reply #23 on: February 28, 2018, 03:40:01 am »
Quote
Thank you for contacting Vera Support.

Please know that this issue has been reported to our development team and we?re working on implementing a fix for it. However at the moment we cannot provide you an exact time frame for this. Once available the fix will be listed on our Release Notes page

Offline Tillsy

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Re: Nightmare Setting Association for a Multi-Channel Device
« Reply #24 on: March 09, 2018, 04:35:22 pm »
Official confirmation is the MultiSensor 6 does not support multi-channel devices... even their own multi-channel products.