Author Topic: Goodbye Vera  (Read 8203 times)

Offline krementz

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Re: Goodbye Vera
« Reply #120 on: June 12, 2018, 07:33:51 am »
Sorin, it sounds like you are heroic at the Alamo, but management and the engineering group aren't supporting you.

I understand integrating Alexa may be "sexy" and "good for marketing". But a simple command - like turn this light on at 7pm for 2.5 hours - breaks erratically. That is fatal. If Vera can't do even that reliably, it is a MAJOR step backwards from a mechanical timer.

It must be frustrating - you hear the wrath but don't have authority to fix the problems.

Well, I have said goodbye Vera, hello Homeseer. I have the two old Veras cleaned out and on simple access point duty now. With no devices or plugins to talk with, it should have turned off its z-wave radio. Everything at one house is running on Homeseer, and so far, no issues.

I'll keep an eagle eye on the Vera at my other location, and change that to Homeseer if the Vera there acts up. Pissed away quite a bit of money.


Offline Sorin

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Re: Goodbye Vera
« Reply #121 on: June 12, 2018, 08:53:52 am »
Thanks for the kind words Krementz. I really appreciate it.

On the other hand, many people associate me with the responsibility of all of the mentioned possible issues and shortcomings. Which is alright in some aspects, but at the same time I'm constantly finding myself reminding my additional role of, the one of taking the pulse of the community, escalate where possible, mediate if possible, report to upper management and hope for a hasty solution.

Where I can step in and "do more" for the community I will surely do it and proof to that is my forum Inbox where people, even some that posted in this thread had issues that I manage to escalate and sort out, even if temporary.
« Last Edit: June 12, 2018, 08:57:08 am by Sorin »
Sorin M. ▾ Community Manager
Vera Control, Ltd. ▾ Smarter Home Control  ▾ support@getvera.com ▾www.getvera.com ▾ +1 (866) 966-2272

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Offline TinCup

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Re: Goodbye Vera
« Reply #122 on: June 12, 2018, 11:28:28 am »
Most of the complaints I read center around UI7, the Vera Plus, and later.  That's the main reason why I never upgraded.  I've got a couple of bridged Vera 3's running UI5 that are happily chugging away (though I did do the external antenna mod on one of them).  I only use them as controllers and moved the automation off to OpenLuup/AltUI.   It's doing everything I need it to do.

Having said that, I've been waiting and hoping that the Vera folks would release the software to install on a VM or Pi or something so we aren't limited by the hardware.   This might help alleviate alot of the complaints.
Vera 3 UI5 | Homewave | Amazon Echo | BWS HA Bridge | PLEG/PLTS | OpenSprinkler | AD2USB | GE/Jasco | Schlage BE469 | Kwikset 912 | ecobee3 | SONOS + TTS | Aeotec 4-in-1 | EcoLink | Everspring ST812 | Remotec ZFM-80 | Evolve LRM-AS/LFM-20 | Hikvision DS-2CD2332 Turret | Dahua IPC-HFW4300S Bullet

Offline jeubanks

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Re: Goodbye Vera
« Reply #123 on: June 12, 2018, 01:35:02 pm »
Most of the complaints I read center around UI7, the Vera Plus, and later.  That's the main reason why I never upgraded.  I've got a couple of bridged Vera 3's running UI5 that are happily chugging away (though I did do the external antenna mod on one of them).  I only use them as controllers and moved the automation off to OpenLuup/AltUI.   It's doing everything I need it to do.

Having said that, I've been waiting and hoping that the Vera folks would release the software to install on a VM or Pi or something so we aren't limited by the hardware.   This might help alleviate alot of the complaints.

To give Vera credit where do, the Vera Plus is a very good z-wave device controller and a decent (not great) Zigbee device controller.  Vera doesn't get the great or even good for Zigbee due to how limited their device support is.  For the devices it does support it is solid.

From my experience the major problems happen from plugins.  Sometimes it's a misbehaving plugin (Vera provided plugins are included in this behavior) and most of the time it's a resource issue.  The little Vera box just can't handle the load.

Like you and others have done.  The trick is in offloading plugins to somewhere else. 

Offline kwieto

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Re: Goodbye Vera
« Reply #124 on: June 12, 2018, 03:09:18 pm »
@Sorin,
Please, don't take our comments personal.
Speaking for myself, I am perfectly aware that you are not the right person to blame for our issues with Vera.
Yet you are our only (except Customer Care) contact with Vera's management or development team and an interface between them and us (users).
I wouldn't like to be at your position - as a front line staff you take most of the load of anger and frustration.
From the other hand, remember that if you have to deal with angry customer, at least you have one. People who complain would like to continue using Vera (If they didn't, they would use other products already, not even saying "goodbye"), you (Vera) just need to give them a chance. Which means that Vera should listen and act accordingly, which I don't feel like it is happening.
Again, it is not your personal responsibility to change that, but as I said, for us you are the Vera's ears.


Offline kigmatzomat

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Re: Goodbye Vera
« Reply #125 on: June 12, 2018, 11:56:55 pm »
Sorin,

I am another refugee who went to HomeSeer. I have a Vera3 and VeraPlus in boxes and I am afraid to give them away because I don't want my friends to blame me for their spousal ire. I repeat, I won't give your products away because it will make me look bad.

And to be honest, there's nothing wrong with the vera3...because it's still on UI5. But I know that at some point the firmware nagbox will get clicked accidentally and I won't hear the end of it. The plus is a janky mess of phantom devices, luup restarts, and UI crawl.

You know what the best features are? Reliability. Consistency. Trustworthiness.

I am still lurking in the off chance that the firmware does get stable.

If anyone were to ask who should buy vera, I would say it's for people who don't want a cloud-based controller, are too cheap to buy a HomeTroller Zee, and dislike the Smartthings scripting language.

Because right now, it's easier to recommend a semi-unknown like Hubitat over Vera.

Please get better.

Offline Grwebster

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Re: Goodbye Vera
« Reply #126 on: June 13, 2018, 09:43:51 pm »
Thanks for the kind words Krementz. I really appreciate it.

On the other hand, many people associate me with the responsibility of all of the mentioned possible issues and shortcomings. Which is alright in some aspects, but at the same time I'm constantly finding myself reminding my additional role of, the one of taking the pulse of the community, escalate where possible, mediate if possible, report to upper management and hope for a hasty solution.

Where I can step in and "do more" for the community I will surely do it and proof to that is my forum Inbox where people, even some that posted in this thread had issues that I manage to escalate and sort out, even if temporary.
We know the you are only the messenger here.  I appreciate your emphasizing with us.  Although there are any number of issues, I feel the upgrade issues dwarf most things.  Probably very hard and expensive to fix though.  Still I think it is critical for Vera to tackle this issue.  Glad to have Alexa in Canada now :)


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

Offline tylergn

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Re: Goodbye Vera
« Reply #127 on: June 15, 2018, 05:09:31 am »
As an update, I have my Hubitat fully up and running now using all of the exact same devices as my Vera Plus previously used. The hub and devices are in the exact same physical location as before. Whereas barely a day went by without Vera's red sad faced home symbol of doom telling me that 1,2,3 or even 4 devices were no longer connected, Hubitat has not lost contact with any. As always it is a bit of a learning curve working out a new system, but I think the Hubitat way of doing things is a good balance of user friendliness while allowing a great deal of complex logic if required. Hubitat, being new, doesn't have maybe quite the list of officially supported devices at the moment, but there is a great community and plenty of custom drivers available and all of my devices are working well, often with increased flexibility of settings over Vera (Aeotec multisensor 6 for example).  I'm still annoyed that I have had to put a lot of effort into moving systems, just because of Vera's unreliability but I'm really glad now that I did.

Offline litby

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Re: Goodbye Vera
« Reply #128 on: June 15, 2018, 01:11:24 pm »
I have two Veras. An Edge, which has only one type of device - 10 RCS thermostats. It has never lost a device or given me trouble in any way. It operates on the US frequency although I am in EU.

Then there is the Plus, an EU model which runs all my lights and sensors. It has never had a day without red bars in the UI. Mostly "can't contact device" but also various "purgng associations " or "failed to exchange security keys" and devices disappearing entirely.

I'm switching to Domoticz on a Xeon server with Aeotec USB sticks.

Offline Mike Yeager

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Re: Goodbye Vera
« Reply #129 on: June 18, 2018, 08:01:38 am »
I myself have moved much of my system over to Home Assistant and am using the my Vera Plus for the device radios and a few things in PLEG. Without PLEG, I would have moved to another platform altogether. Years ago, all I heard was good things about MicasaVerde controllers. I've gotten rid of the constant Luup restarts, but the devices disconnecting now and then is still there. Worst part is, often they aren't actually disconnected....

Offline rafale77

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Re: Goodbye Vera
« Reply #130 on: June 19, 2018, 02:35:08 am »
The last straw has been pulled for me too. I am now experiencing exactly what Mike Yeager is describing. I have few devices go "can't detected" even though they seem to function perfectly. I wake them up and they lose the error message but the message comes back within 5 min. Have not seen this in a long time and I thought it was fixed in firmware.
I am replacing my vera plus with a pine 64 + aeotec Gen5 Zstick running homeassistant on Armbian which will have cost me <35% of the price I paid for the VP.
It is a Quad Core ARM 1.2GHz SoC vs. the Dual Core MIPS 880MHz SoC for the VP (~8X CPU performance), 2GB vs. 256MB (8X the RAM), 60GB MLC NAND(I am using a previously retired SSD on USB) vs. 128MB SLC NAND (50X the storage).
I will just have to move all the vera triggers into home assistant so as to trigger actions on openLuup which is time I will get back from not having to fix the vera. Not looking forward to the project but looking forward to the result.

I will continue to follow this forum just because I still will be running and writing code on openLuup.

Best of luck!
openLuup (96 devices, 122 scenes, 20 apps) controlling HomeAss + VeraPlus (133 zwave nodes, 8 Zigbee nodes, 200 devices, 29 scenes , 1 apps) Bridged to Homekit and Alexa

Offline jeubanks

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Re: Goodbye Vera
« Reply #131 on: June 19, 2018, 11:54:14 am »
The last straw has been pulled for me too. I am now experiencing exactly what Mike Yeager is describing. I have few devices go "can't detected" even though they seem to function perfectly. I wake them up and they lose the error message but the message comes back within 5 min. Have not seen this in a long time and I thought it was fixed in firmware.
I am replacing my vera plus with a pine 64 + aeotec Gen5 Zstick running homeassistant on Armbian which will have cost me <35% of the price I paid for the VP.
It is a Quad Core ARM 1.2GHz SoC vs. the Dual Core MIPS 880MHz SoC for the VP (~8X CPU performance), 2GB vs. 256MB (8X the RAM), 60GB MLC NAND(I am using a previously retired SSD on USB) vs. 128MB SLC NAND (50X the storage).
I will just have to move all the vera triggers into home assistant so as to trigger actions on openLuup which is time I will get back from not having to fix the vera. Not looking forward to the project but looking forward to the result.

I will continue to follow this forum just because I still will be running and writing code on openLuup.

Best of luck!

Good Luck!

I ran with Home Assistant for a while with Vera as the device controller.  A VeraPlus with NO apps and only devices runs ok.  I had issues with Home Assistant controlling devices that Open Zwave does NOT currently support.  (Barrier Class Devices.... ie Garage Door).  The support is coming and it's in Beta... but just FYI.  Home Assistant is great, but it's still in massive development mode and it's hard to pin down a stable release.  But it's fun to mess with I still have HA on an rPI.

I have since moved on to HomeSeer and I wrote a plugin to interface with Vera for devices that HomeSeer does not support (ie Zigbee).

Offline rafale77

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Re: Goodbye Vera
« Reply #132 on: June 19, 2018, 03:49:23 pm »
@jeubanks this is good input. Thank you! I might consider running homeseer on the pine instead.
I am already running Home assistant on my own fork for a large number of integration.

As I continue to migrating more of my logic from the vera to openLuup, I ran into a massive data corruption this morning on the vera. Editing some scenes and deleting devices lead to the vera suddenly go into an infinite Luup reload process (every 30s). Rebooting, recovering from a known good backup did nothing. I ended up having to run a factory reset, firmware reload and recover from that same backup. I have no idea what got corrupted. I suspect that I may also be getting bad sectors on the storage NAND of the VP which I will check later.
I am left with only 1 plugin: System Monitor. No more virtual devices, only zwave and zigbee and their child devices and a small subset of scenes which sync with openLuup.
Luup reload frequency have significantly decreased. I am still dealing with devices going "can't detect" even though they work fine. I am really looking forward to get rid of the vera.
openLuup (96 devices, 122 scenes, 20 apps) controlling HomeAss + VeraPlus (133 zwave nodes, 8 Zigbee nodes, 200 devices, 29 scenes , 1 apps) Bridged to Homekit and Alexa

Offline Minok

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Re: Goodbye Vera
« Reply #133 on: June 19, 2018, 07:03:36 pm »
I've had the Vera Plus for a few years now and only run it at a basic level, and am also frustrated by the lack of ability by the company to get its basic built in features working.

I've been 'testing' the geofence feature for over  a year and get the alerts I've left/entered pretty reliably.
But that the usage of that data is pointless because Vera's own app won't change the house mode as it says it will (ie I'm the only user, I leave, I get the notification that I left, I'm sitting at work and see my dashboard has me in "NIGHT" mode )  <facepalm>

So I'll continue to use it to do the most basic things and only that - be a conduit between my iPhone and turning on my outdoor and some indoor/hue lighting, and thats it.  It all seems so promising in the marketing paper and spec sheet, but the execution is just lacking.

That said, there's yet another new update begging to be installed (1.7.3831) so I'll do that and see.

Offline rafale77

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Re: Goodbye Vera
« Reply #134 on: June 19, 2018, 10:42:28 pm »

Good Luck!

I ran with Home Assistant for a while with Vera as the device controller.  A VeraPlus with NO apps and only devices runs ok.  I had issues with Home Assistant controlling devices that Open Zwave does NOT currently support.  (Barrier Class Devices.... ie Garage Door).  The support is coming and it's in Beta... but just FYI.  Home Assistant is great, but it's still in massive development mode and it's hard to pin down a stable release.  But it's fun to mess with I still have HA on an rPI.

I have since moved on to HomeSeer and I wrote a plugin to interface with Vera for devices that HomeSeer does not support (ie Zigbee).

I was just thinking about your comment on "massive development mode" of home assistant which ironically is still more stable and mature than where vera is. Any version whether dev or release I have tested going back several 3 months now has been more reliable than the vera!

I may now have to go hunt for a really solid zwave controller with an API. I have waited long enough for the vera.

openLuup (96 devices, 122 scenes, 20 apps) controlling HomeAss + VeraPlus (133 zwave nodes, 8 Zigbee nodes, 200 devices, 29 scenes , 1 apps) Bridged to Homekit and Alexa