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Author Topic: One Z-Wave switch in 3 way circuit  (Read 20582 times)

Offline mundyb

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One Z-Wave switch in 3 way circuit
« on: January 20, 2012, 08:46:44 pm »
Forgive me if this has been brought up before.  But the forum search is a little too literal, and I didn't find exactly what I was looking for.  Do you know how many words have "one" in them... :o   :)

I am assuming that you can wire one Z-Wave 3 way switch into a circuit and have the other be a normal 3 way switch.  I was just wondering if anyone could confirm this.  Does it still work well, as far as knowing the status of the circuit On/Off condition?

Adding up the amount of 3 way's I'd have to replace is pretty scary at nearly 50 bucks a pop!  Does anybody know a cheap, reliable, place to get them besides Amazon?

Thanks
« Last Edit: January 20, 2012, 09:03:01 pm by mundyb »

Offline mundyb

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Re: One Z-Wave switch in 3 way circuit
« Reply #1 on: January 20, 2012, 08:54:01 pm »
In case you were wondering Wolfram Alpha says that 770 words in the English language contain the sequence "one".hahaha  The internet...

Offline aa6vh

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Re: One Z-Wave switch in 3 way circuit
« Reply #2 on: January 21, 2012, 02:40:06 pm »
I am assuming that you can wire one Z-Wave 3 way switch into a circuit and have the other be a normal 3 way switch.  I was just wondering if anyone could confirm this.  Does it still work well, as far as knowing the status of the circuit On/Off condition?

Unfortunately, no, regular switches will not work like that. On the three way circuit, you do require the special switches that accompany the main Zwave switch. The auxiliary switches do not directly switch on or off the light - they just notify the main Zwave switch to turn the light on or off.

You will also need to have the neutral wire present in the auxiliary switch boxes.

Offline oTi@

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Re: One Z-Wave switch in 3 way circuit
« Reply #3 on: January 21, 2012, 03:39:18 pm »
Also, because the aux switches have fewer electronics, they  are a lot cheaper than the primary switch.
Dezwaved at the moment...

Offline Frasier

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Re: One Z-Wave switch in 3 way circuit
« Reply #4 on: January 22, 2012, 12:15:42 pm »
Another option if you have suitable access to the wiring could be to use something like the Fibar FGS211 (in Europe) and place it near the light fitting so that the switched live connects to the S1 terminal for manual control of the lighting. You  then don't need to replace any of the existing switches but will need Live and Neutral connections for the Fibar module.

Offline kkl

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Re: One Z-Wave switch in 3 way circuit
« Reply #5 on: March 03, 2012, 12:35:08 pm »
I am assuming that you can wire one Z-Wave 3 way switch into a circuit and have the other be a normal 3 way switch.  I was just wondering if anyone could confirm this.

You can do this with the no-longer-manufactured Intermatic HA-14C / Wayne-Dalton HA-14WD.  I have about a dozen of these switches working fine.  You can still find these for sale.

Offline aseriesoftubes

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Re: One Z-Wave switch in 3 way circuit
« Reply #6 on: March 05, 2012, 09:57:40 pm »
Would the HomePro AS101 do the trick? It's <$15 at smarthome-products.com (sorry, I can't post a link).

Offline ASIHome

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Re: One Z-Wave switch in 3 way circuit
« Reply #7 on: March 06, 2012, 11:52:28 am »
The AS101 has no Z-Wave in it whatsoever.

Offline vera_nc

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Re: One Z-Wave switch in 3 way circuit
« Reply #8 on: March 06, 2012, 08:42:00 pm »
You can also use the discontinued CA600 Dimmers or CA3000 Relay switches with regular 3way switches. I found them on Ebay for less than $20 each in a 6 pack Buy it now deal.

The only quirk is that you have to have Hot and Load in the same box as the Z-Wave switch.

Sent using Tapatalk from my Samsung Galaxy S II
« Last Edit: March 06, 2012, 08:44:24 pm by vera_nc »

Offline kkl

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Re: One Z-Wave switch in 3 way circuit
« Reply #9 on: March 14, 2012, 07:51:33 pm »
I ran into a problem in my new house, because, even though the electrician was instructed to have a neutral in every box, he installed many "dead-end" 4-way and 5-way circuits.  This meant that the line/hot and load/light wires were in the same box and the white/neutral wire was converted to a traveler.  The telltale sign of this is a white wire wrapped in black electrical tape at its end.  I contacted Intermatic who said that the HA-14C wouldn't work in this scenario.  After reviewing the situation for awhile and getting a brain cramp from trying to understand multi-way circuits, I figured out how to do it.

The first image is what a typical multi-way dead-end circuits looks like.  The second is how I converted it to use HA-14C / HA-14WD switches.  The first switch beyond the Z-wave switch is changed from a standard 4-way to a standard 3-way switch.  Otherwise, the wiring changes are only in the Z-wave switch box.  The third and fourth images are wiring diagrams from Intermatic for the HA14 and the CA600.  It looks to me like this wiring method will also work with the CA600.

   

Offline emellqui

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Re: One Z-Wave switch in 3 way circuit
« Reply #10 on: March 01, 2013, 05:59:50 pm »
I'm looking for some wiring help with an Intermatic CA600.  I know this has been discussed a lot in this thread and others (http://forum.micasaverde.com/index.php/topic,10295.0.html). I've read every relevant post, and I can't figure out a way to get the switches working in my current situation.

My wiring diagram is attached.  If anybody would take a look at it and provide some advice, I would appreciate it.  There is no way my wife is going to let me cut any holes in the wall, so I have to work with the wires that are in there right now.  My end goal is a dimmer (CA600) where the  first 3-way switch currently sits.  If someone can figure out a way to make this work, great.  If not, does anyone know of a combination of switches that would work with my wiring?

Thank you to everyone who has already contributed to this topic.  You've been a huge help.

Offline kkl

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Re: One Z-Wave switch in 3 way circuit
« Reply #11 on: March 01, 2013, 06:58:35 pm »
Believe it or not, having standard wiring like you do is actually worst-case scenario for installing the CA600 in a 3+ switch circuit.  Without having that "extra wire" available, you simply cannot use a CA600 with 3 standard switches.  However, if 2 out of 3 of those other switch boxes have a hot/line supplying another switch, you may be able to use the CA5100 in those boxes.  The CA5100 needs an unswitched hot/line and neutral.  It does not need to be on the same circuit as the CA600.  Attached is a diagram showing one possibility.  I have one 3-switch circuit operating this way.

Thanks for providing the wiring diagram.  It makes it much easier for others to help when you've done your homework.

« Last Edit: March 01, 2013, 07:03:45 pm by kkl »

Offline emellqui

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Re: One Z-Wave switch in 3 way circuit
« Reply #12 on: March 01, 2013, 09:50:47 pm »
Thanks for the reply and the advice. I was thinking that I could just remove 2 of the switches to make it work, but your idea is much better. Having 2 blank plates/dummy switches isn't a very elegant solution. I'll have to look and see if I have other lines available (there are wall outlets below those switches). Thanks again.

Offline kkl

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Re: One Z-Wave switch in 3 way circuit
« Reply #13 on: March 02, 2013, 12:21:59 pm »
This is one of those situations where a Leviton would be much simpler and possibly not that much more expensive considering the relatively low price of accessory switches.

Offline kkl

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Re: One Z-Wave switch in 3 way circuit
« Reply #14 on: March 27, 2013, 10:24:05 am »
I just thought of another potential wiring option for a conventional multi-way circuit where the hot/line is at one end and light/load is at the other, when no "additional wire" is available.  IF there is another hot/line source in the end switch box where the light/load connects (i.e. from another switch), the circuit can probably be converted to a dead end configuration.  If neither circuit is GFCI/AFCI, then it shouldn't matter if the neutral is from the same or different circuit.

 
« Last Edit: March 27, 2013, 01:13:25 pm by kkl »