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General => Lighting & Load Control => Topic started by: agoodman82 on April 13, 2012, 11:16:27 pm

Title: 20 Amp Z-Wave Outlet
Post by: agoodman82 on April 13, 2012, 11:16:27 pm
I've seen several versions of a 15 Amp Z-wave wall outlets/receptacles. Are there any existing 20 Amp z-wave wall outlets? I have a wall unit air conditioner that requires a 20 amp outlet and was looking for a z-wave solution for the unit. I did a search of various z-wave products sites and I haven't seen anything mentioned about a 20 amp z-wave outlet. Most appliances/devices only require 15 amp connections so I could see the need for a z-wave solution for this not being a number one priority at the moment. If there isn't anything available, has anyone heard of something potentially in the works?? Thanks.
Title: Re: 20 Amp Z-Wave Outlet
Post by: guessed on April 13, 2012, 11:37:15 pm
You can search on "contactor" and find ones for larger loads.  Things like the Evolve LFM-20 will come up, and could likely be used if you have a large enough wall box to run it, and the (switched) socket.
Title: Re: 20 Amp Z-Wave Outlet
Post by: mpicco on April 23, 2012, 01:56:32 pm
Here's a contactor, with monitoring: http://www.rcstechnology.com/images/pdfs/power-monitoring-control-contactor.pdf
Regards,

Michael Picco
Title: Re: 20 Amp Z-Wave Outlet
Post by: agoodman82 on May 04, 2012, 10:23:54 am
Thanks guys, I'll check those out. I just took the plunge and got a VeraLite. So far, I don't have any z-wave outlets yet, but I am correct in assuming that I can use a z-wave outlet like I am looking for here to power my wall-unit AC on and off, right?
Title: Re: 20 Amp Z-Wave Outlet
Post by: agoodman82 on May 31, 2012, 04:15:17 pm
I know there are some X10 devices supported by Vera. Has anyone had any experience using the below as a 20 amp solution pairing it with Vera?

http://www.x10.com/automation/hd245_s.html (http://www.x10.com/automation/hd245_s.html)
Title: Re: 20 Amp Z-Wave Outlet
Post by: strangely on June 01, 2012, 12:30:05 am
Is it a 220V circuit that you want to control? If you wanted to use this, then you would also need to buy something like an RFXtrx to control and interface it with Vera.
Title: Re: 20 Amp Z-Wave Outlet
Post by: agoodman82 on June 01, 2012, 12:31:35 pm
Hi Strangely:

Yes, I believe the circuit I want to control is 220v (it's a wall-mounted AC unit that runs off of a 20 amp outlet). So what you're saying is that if I wanted to use that X10 appliance module in place of my current 20 amp outlet I'd have to also purchase a transmitter like the RFXtrx to pick up the X10 signals? Vera itself can't communicate with X10 devices?

Would that transmitter get plugged into the Vera unit via USB?
Title: Re: 20 Amp Z-Wave Outlet
Post by: guessed on June 01, 2012, 01:41:06 pm
Hi Strangely:

Yes, I believe the circuit I want to control is 220v (it's a wall-mounted AC unit that runs off of a 20 amp outlet). So what you're saying is that if I wanted to use that X10 appliance module in place of my current 20 amp outlet I'd have to also purchase a transmitter like the RFXtrx to pick up the X10 signals? Vera itself can't communicate with X10 devices?

Would that transmitter get plugged into the Vera unit via USB?
To talk anything other than Z-Wave (or a native TCP-device) you always need some sort of external adapter to Vera, in addition to support for that adapter (either built in, via a supported PLM, or via a plugin like that for the RFXtrx)

What's not clear to me is why you're not using one of the standard Z-Wave 20A Contactors, or one of the 30+ Amp variants that's been discussed, that can be driven by a standard Z-Wave appliance module)

If you want to know what I mean, do a search on "contactor"
Title: Re: 20 Amp Z-Wave Outlet
Post by: strangely on June 01, 2012, 04:24:23 pm
Yes, I believe the circuit I want to control is 220v

I believe 20A circuits can be either 110 or 220V (not 100% sure), but I think you can tell by the blades of the plug for the appliance.

220V 20A is something like:

  o
_   _

110V 20A is something like:

  o
_   |

Regular 110V 15A is something like:
 
  o
|   |
Title: Re: 20 Amp Z-Wave Outlet
Post by: aschwalb on June 01, 2012, 04:32:55 pm
220V 20A is something like:

  o
_   _

110V 20A is something like:

  o
_   |

Regular 110V 15A is something like:
 
  o
|   |


Nice use of the ASCII character set...   ;D
Title: Re: 20 Amp Z-Wave Outlet
Post by: strangely on June 01, 2012, 04:47:38 pm
Thanks thumbs Up!

 ( ((
  \ =\
__\_ `-\
(____))( \-------
(____)) _
(____))
(____))____/----
Title: Re: Re: 20 Amp Z-Wave Outlet
Post by: jwiz on June 01, 2012, 07:00:58 pm
Yes, I believe the circuit I want to control is 220v

I believe 20A circuits can be either 110 or 220V (not 100% sure), but I think you can tell by the blades of the plug for the appliance.

220V 20A is something like:

  o
_   _

110V 20A is something like:

  o
_   |

Regular 110V 15A is something like:
 
  o
|   |

I do prefer my grounds down and not up though :))
Title: Re: 20 Amp Z-Wave Outlet
Post by: strangely on June 01, 2012, 08:19:58 pm
You are obviously a down to ground type of guy (or girl) :)

Correct though you probably are about which way up they should be (or rather down), It was more to reflect how the plugs themselves looked since the wall sockets are a bit more tricky to depict since having "T" a shaped hole, and when you hold a plug/cable it could be either :)

A 220V 20A socket would be something like this:

-|   -
   o
Title: Re: Re: 20 Amp Z-Wave Outlet
Post by: jwiz on June 01, 2012, 08:48:31 pm
You are obviously a down to ground type of guy (or girl) :)

Correct though you probably are about which way up they should be (or rather down), It was more to reflect how the plugs themselves looked since the wall sockets are a bit more tricky to depict since having "T" a shaped hole, and when you hold a plug/cable it could be either :)

A 220V 20A socket would be something like this:

-|   -
   o

I just wanted to bust your chops. I couldn't help myself ;D I know some people that are anal about which way the ground should be.

John
Title: Re: 20 Amp Z-Wave Outlet
Post by: guessed on June 01, 2012, 09:08:20 pm
Except for those "upside down" sockets in the US that are switched.  The first time I saw that I thought it was just dodgy wiring.  ;-)
Title: Re: 20 Amp Z-Wave Outlet
Post by: strangely on June 01, 2012, 09:54:51 pm
Well dodgy is probably true since I don't think any house should be wired with lights that are not on the celing! I was also surprised by this when I moved here!
Title: Re: 20 Amp Z-Wave Outlet
Post by: agoodman82 on June 02, 2012, 01:37:12 am
Haha, thanks for the replies (and the ascii art).

It is 110v (I just knew it was 20 amp but not the voltage till I looked at it). Guessed: The only reason I haven't been looking into contactors was only because I don't really know a lot about z-wave control yet :) I did see the 20 amp contactor shown here:

http://store.homeseer.com/store/Evolve-LFM-20-Z-Wave-Relay-Fixture-Module-P1007.aspx

Is this the smallest 20 amp contractor made? I did see some smaller contractors before but I'm assuming they would not be able to handle a 20 amp load because they were small enough to be wedged into a single gang box with the outlet you want to control. Although I'm not an expert in electrical wiring, I'm assuming I would wire the contactor up by connecting it to the wiring between the gang box and a 20 amp electrical outlet? The contactor basically acts as a z-wave controlled on/off switch and from what I've read, the device attached can then only be controlled via z-wave and not a remote (i.e.: my AC connected could then only be turned off via z-wave and not the remote that came with the AC)? Thanks for the help guys! I'm new to all this but definitely trying to learn...
Title: Re: 20 Amp Z-Wave Outlet
Post by: guessed on June 02, 2012, 01:01:46 pm
There are a few Contactor modules floating around.   Most of them list their resistive loads, and some also list their load capability for inductive loads as well.


The larger ones are for controlling pool motors/heaters etc.  Most of the standard form-factor devices are only 15A (plugin or built-in).  I've not seen any lately that are 20A.

I'd be a little concerned about just nuking the power on an AirCond unit, esp if it's mid-cycle at the time.  If might be more gentle on the electrics to use IR, although not as "guaranteed" to be off, of course.