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General => Lighting & Load Control => Topic started by: radarengineer on April 18, 2012, 10:46:38 am

Title: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: radarengineer on April 18, 2012, 10:46:38 am
Automatedoutlet.com appears to be clearing out their inventory of Intermatic Z-wave devices.

They are selling intermatic Z-wave 6 packs (both CA600 dimmers and CA3000 switches) on ebay for $99 buy-it-now. People who are evidently not good with ebay are putting in low ball bids (which closes out the buy it now price) and some of the 6 packs are going up to ~$130, but if you can click a buy-it-now before someone else puts in a low ball bid you can get it for $99.

I've purchased several and they have arrived within a few days. Automatedoutlet.com seems to have a great reputation on the Cocoontech forums. I'm obviously very happy with them from these last few purchases.

These devices are discontinued but I'm quite happy with them. They use standard 2 way switches instead of proprietary extenders for 3 way operation. Thanks to this sale I now have enough switches and dimmers to convert every last light switch in my house to z-wave  :). (I do have a much smaller house than other people on here I'm sure!).
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: kkl on April 18, 2012, 12:31:15 pm
It is a good deal.  I thought I might be the only one who noticed the idiotic bidding.  I put bids on a few auctions to try to get it below $99, but these morons kept bidding above the Buy It Now price.  One auction went to $142!

These InTouch switches appear to be of high quality.  The "dimples" do make them look different than a standard paddle switch, and some people might not like that.

I like the feature that you can use them with standard switches in a multi-way circuit.  The problem occurs when you have a total of 3 or more switches because an additional traveler wire is required.  The CA600 wiring is similar to the HA14C / HA14WD.  For those who have a "dead-end" multi-way circuit, I've posted directions in this thread:  http://forum.micasaverde.com/index.php/topic,9160.msg66835.html#msg66835 (http://forum.micasaverde.com/index.php/topic,9160.msg66835.html#msg66835).

Edit:  The instructions that I found online (http://www.smarthome-products.com/productspecs/CA600-Manual.pdf (http://www.smarthome-products.com/productspecs/CA600-Manual.pdf)) for the CA600 are a little different than those in the box, so I've scanned a copy and am attaching it here.  These include the option for a single-pole switch in a 3-way circuit, like the HA14C.
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: akashk on April 18, 2012, 04:57:13 pm
Can't seem to find this on eBay. Any link?
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: kkl on April 18, 2012, 05:05:14 pm
Search for "CA600 Pack" or "CA3000 Pack".  It looks like someone has placed a bid on every auction right now.  Sometimes you have to wait for auctions to complete before the seller lists more with a Buy It Now price.
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: davedecali on April 18, 2012, 05:22:37 pm
Quick question.

Can these dimmers be associated with other devices ie. double click turns on/off other zwave controlled switches like the ZDW120?
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: kkl on April 19, 2012, 12:26:42 am
Quick question.

Can these dimmers be associated with other devices ie. double click turns on/off other zwave controlled switches like the ZDW120?
I haven't tried it myself, but I believe they can act as a single scene controller, but you choose one or the other - local load or scene.  See Chapter 3 (page 28) of this document:  http://www.intouchcontrols.com/~/media/Files/InTouchControls/User%20Guide%20-%20English.ashx (http://www.intouchcontrols.com/~/media/Files/InTouchControls/User%20Guide%20-%20English.ashx)
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: swazi on April 20, 2012, 10:27:44 am
It is a good deal.  I thought I might be the only one who noticed the idiotic bidding.  I put bids on a few auctions to try to get it below $99, but these morons kept bidding above the Buy It Now price.  One auction went to $142!

These InTouch switches appear to be of high quality.  The "dimples" do make them look different than a standard paddle switch, and some people might not like that.

I like the feature that you can use them with standard switches in a multi-way circuit.  The problem occurs when you have a total of 3 or more switches because an additional traveler wire is required.  The CA600 wiring is similar to the HA14C / HA14WD.  For those who have a "dead-end" multi-way circuit, I've posted directions in this thread: 
Edit:  The instructions that I found online  for the CA600 are a little different than those in the box, so I've scanned a copy and am attaching it here.  These include the option for a single-pole switch in a 3-way circuit, like the HA14C.

Thanks for all the useful information!
When you say "standard switches", do you mean ANY switch (as long as it is 3/4pole)? So I can pick up some cheap regular switches at Home Depot and it will work?
I have one specific circuit that is bending my mind... 4 way circuit of which one is a dimmer (no on/off) and the other two are switches. And 2 lights. In all honesty I have not looked at the wiring yet, so do not know what to expect. But what I would like to do is replace the existing with 3 dimmable switches (with z-wave/insteon function).
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: saintirish on April 20, 2012, 04:29:43 pm
Hello, I am new to the forums and new to home automation.  After doing some searching for switches, I found these on eBay and then found this post.  It seems like a great deal.

Can anyone tell me if these will work with CFLs or LCDs??  Does it make a difference if the switch controls MANY CFLs or LEDs??

Also, if I just want to switch on and off and don't care about dimming, then CA3000 is the one for me, right?
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: Aaron on April 20, 2012, 04:38:20 pm
they are $199 / per pack now.
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: PurdueGuy on April 20, 2012, 04:46:56 pm
For CFL/LED, you want the CA3000.  That is just On/Off (do dimming)

How many bulbs depends on the switch & size of each bulb.  How many are you talking about?

CA3000 has the following rating:
Ratings:
120VAC, 50/60Hz 1800 Watts 15A Tungsten;
1800 Watts 15A Resistive/Inductive;
1800VA 15A Ballast;
1/2HP Motor
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: saintirish on April 20, 2012, 05:24:10 pm
It will be for 3 LED floods

OR 2 100w equivalent CFLs (or more . . . depending where I put them)
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: PurdueGuy on April 20, 2012, 05:25:17 pm
You should be fine, that shouldn't be anywhere close to what the switch is rated for.
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: saintirish on April 20, 2012, 05:30:25 pm
I wasn't worried about going over, I was worried that it wouldn't work at all or would flicker as I have heard that many switches that are on CFLs or LEDs don't work.
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: PurdueGuy on April 20, 2012, 05:31:31 pm
I wasn't worried about going over, I was worried that it wouldn't work at all or would flicker as I have heard that many switches that are on CFLs or LEDs don't work.
Oh, I see.  The dimmers could cause flickering, but the relay (on/off) switches should be fine.
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: saintirish on April 20, 2012, 05:31:40 pm
they are $199 / per pack now.

Incorrect.  I just bought the CA3000 6 pack on eBay for $99 plus $10 shipping . . . of course, I got the last one currently, but I bought it after your post.  They seem to be posting more of these often.  Just keep an eye out.

There are several CA600 packs still that are being bid on, but they are all around $20 bids right now.

http://www.ebay.com/dsc/i.html?_nkw=intermatic+ca600+pack&_sacat=0&_stpos=24551&_sop=16&gbr=1&_odkw=intermatic+ca600&_osacat=0&_trksid=p3286.c0.m270.l1313&LH_TitleDesc=1
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: kkl on April 20, 2012, 08:20:21 pm
Thanks for all the useful information!
When you say "standard switches", do you mean ANY switch (as long as it is 3/4pole)? So I can pick up some cheap regular switches at Home Depot and it will work?
I have one specific circuit that is bending my mind... 4 way circuit of which one is a dimmer (no on/off) and the other two are switches. And 2 lights. In all honesty I have not looked at the wiring yet, so do not know what to expect. But what I would like to do is replace the existing with 3 dimmable switches (with z-wave/insteon function).
I'm pretty sure that dimmer switches will not work with Intermatic Z-wave switches.  If you need dimming capability at each switch, you should look at other Z-wave brands, like Leviton.  "Standard switches" means regular on/off switches.  Wiring generally goes like this:

Two switches:
Power/Line <> CA600 <> 3-way switch <> Light/Load
   OR
Power/Line <> CA600 <> Single pole switch <> Light/Load

Three switches:
Power/Line <> CA600 <> 3-way switch <> 3-way switch <> Light/Load
Note that this is different than standard wiring where the "middle" switch would be a 4-way.  You would replace your 4-way switch with a 3-way switch.

Four or more switches:
Power/Line <> CA600 <> 3-way switch <> 4-way switch <> 3-way switch <> Light/Load
You can add additional 4-way switches as needed.

Take notice that an additional wire is required to run from the blue wire on the CA600 to the light/load.  This is non-standard wiring.  If you can't re-wire and have a white/neutral wire running with your black and red traveller wires between switches, you may be able to re-purpose it since none of these switches requires a neutral.  If you have a "dead-end" multi-way circuit, where the line and load wires are both in the box with the CA600, you can follow the directions I linked to in the earlier post.
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: Intrepid on April 21, 2012, 07:55:13 am
Thanks for posting this, radar.

I just noticed this thread this morning, and there was a CA3000 pack with no bids, so I bought it.  I already have 3 of these for ceiling fans and they work great.  Under $20/each is a good deal.

Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: Aaron on April 21, 2012, 12:24:34 pm
Look like the only way to create a 3/4 way circuit is to use the Intermatic CA-3PS / 4PS -- this is also what the user manual shows.
... the problem is, I did a web search, and ebay search and these don't seem to be found anywhere?

Do you guys think we could just use the CA600 at each location and tie all of them together using a scene - sort of a 'fake' 3/4 way circuit?

GROUP BUY...
Anyone interested in trying to do a group buy on these? If you are, post how many of each you'd buy and I'll see what I can setup.


Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: kkl on April 21, 2012, 01:16:47 pm
Look like the only way to create a 3/4 way circuit is to use the Intermatic CA-3PS / 4PS -- this is also what the user manual shows.
... the problem is, I did a web search, and ebay search and these don't seem to be found anywhere?

You're misreading that.  The directions say "CA-3PS / Standard 3-Way Switch".  Intermatic brand is not required.  In the list of features is "Multiple location On/Off control using conventional 3-way or 4-way wiring and devices."  This is a unique feature of the Intermatic Z-wave switches unlike Leviton and GE/Jasco which require their own proprietary accessory/coordinating switches.
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: saintirish on April 23, 2012, 10:33:16 am
Thanks for posting this, radar.

I just noticed this thread this morning, and there was a CA3000 pack with no bids, so I bought it.  I already have 3 of these for ceiling fans and they work great.  Under $20/each is a good deal.

Thanks for posting about this.  I ordered the CA3000 wall switches for my regular lights, and if these work, I would like to expand further.  Can you verify for me that the CA600 is what you're using for ceiling fans, and have you had great success with them??
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: Intrepid on April 23, 2012, 10:52:31 am


Thanks for posting about this.  I ordered the CA3000 wall switches for my regular lights, and if these work, I would like to expand further.  Can you verify for me that the CA600 is what you're using for ceiling fans, and have you had great success with them??

You have it reversed.

The CA3000s are relay on/off wall switches for lights, fans, CFL, LEDs.  A simple on/off relay with a loud 'click', but they'll work with anything.  These do not dim...on/off only.

The CA600s are dimmer switches for incandescent bulbs.  Some CFLs/LEDs may work (I use GE dimmers with HomeDepot Utilitech LEDs).  Fans/motors will NOT work.

Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: kkl on April 23, 2012, 11:25:37 am
Anyone been able to get these to work with the jumpered 3-way switch?  The instructions are confusing as they don't show which connection is the common terminal, and if you assume that it is the side with the "lone" terminal, there is a difference between the packaged instructions and the online instructions.  I tried it both ways and it didn't work. The single pole switch does work as the other switch in a 2 switch circuit.  Because I couldn't get a 3-way switch to work using the instructions, I wired up a circuit using the Intermatic HA14 instructions.  The yellow/red traveler goes to the common terminal, a wire from one of the other terminals goes to the light (tied to the switch's blue wire), and the other terminal is unused.  This seems to work fine.  I have not tried the CA600 with 3 or more switches.

This is how I believe these switches work:  Since the black wire goes to power/line and the blue lead goes to light/load, the Z-wave switch can always control the light, regardless of the position of the standard switches.  When you add in standard switches, the Z-wave switch senses when the standard switches have opened or closed the circuit and decides whether to send power through the blue wire, red/yellow wire, or neither.

Edit:  I installed another switch and got the jumpered standard 3-way switch to work with it.  After looking at the wiring diagrams again, I realized that they are functionally equivalent.  The important point is that the traveler wire from the blue lead is the one that is jumpered to the wire going to the light and that one or the other is connected to the common terminal.  As long as the wire from the yellow/red wire is not connected to the common and is not one that is jumpered, I think it will work.  It still seems easier to use the HA14 instructions though.

Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: saintirish on April 24, 2012, 11:32:04 am


You have it reversed.

The CA3000s are relay on/off wall switches for lights, fans, CFL, LEDs.  A simple on/off relay with a loud 'click', but they'll work with anything.  These do not dim...on/off only.

The CA600s are dimmer switches for incandescent bulbs.  Some CFLs/LEDs may work (I use GE dimmers with HomeDepot Utilitech LEDs).  Fans/motors will NOT work.

No I knew that the CA3000s were relay on/off.  My question was if CA600s could be used for fans.  I guess according to what you're saying, they can't be used to dim fans on and off and in between.  But you mentioned that you already had 3 of these for ceiling fans.  Do you just use them as on/off rather than speed control for the fan? 

If Intermatic doesn't make anything for fans, what is the cheapest switch that can control fans (with speed control)?
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: garrettwp on April 24, 2012, 12:03:26 pm
Only zwave option I know of is leviton and not cheap. You can try insteon for fan and light, which I am going to do. And use fba's altsteon plugin.

- Garrett
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: PurdueGuy on April 24, 2012, 01:52:18 pm
Only zwave option I know of is leviton and not cheap. You can try insteon for fan and light, which I am going to do. And use fba's altsteon plugin.

- Garrett
For my additional fans, I gave up on the Leviton VRF01 due to cost.  I'm using a relay switch, and the remote.  I almost never use the fan light nor never go above low.  So I still have On/Off via Z-wave, but not speed control, which is fine for me.
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: hugheaves on April 26, 2012, 11:38:06 am
Thanks for the tip. Just picked up a 6 pack of CA3000's _and_ CA600's for $99 each, once I setup an RSS feed to alert me as soon as they were listed.

It always amazes me when items are available for less on "buy-it-now" than they are going for on auction, but people still bid on them (instead of just buying them). I guess the thrill of bidding for an auction that you probably won't win, and (if you win) paying more for the item than it's worth a whole week later is a strong draw. :)

Hugh
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: oTi@ on April 26, 2012, 11:47:53 am
... and probably why eBay happily keeps making the BIN option disappear after the first bid is in (for most categories).
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: kkl on April 26, 2012, 06:30:21 pm
As I mentioned earlier in this thread, the directions from Intermatic vary for installing these with a 3-way switch.  I contacted Automated Outlet tech support about this and was told that they're seeing these differing instructions packaged in the boxes.  I was advised that the correct wiring is the one online.  The common terminal is connected to the light and that connection is jumpered to the wire coming from the blue wire on the CA600.  I thought I had tried that and it didn't work, but I am not 100% certain I had it correct.  I have wired circuits using the wiring diagrams of the Intermatic HA14, and both of those work.  See attachment. 

Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: BOFH on April 26, 2012, 07:32:22 pm
As I only need 3 CA3000 and 3CA600 (due to the wiring my '72 built house not having neutral at all locations) I sent an email to the seller if I could mix'n'match. Received a reply within 10 minutes that was no problem. Very nice!

Figured I'd share that info in case there is others who'd like to Mix'n'Match.

Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: radarengineer on April 27, 2012, 11:08:15 am
Only zwave option I know of is leviton and not cheap. You can try insteon for fan and light, which I am going to do. And use fba's altsteon plugin.

- Garrett
For my additional fans, I gave up on the Leviton VRF01 due to cost.  I'm using a relay switch, and the remote.  I almost never use the fan light nor never go above low.  So I still have On/Off via Z-wave, but not speed control, which is fine for me.

I'm doing the same thing, relays + lcd ceiling fan remotes (made by this oem: http://www.fan-light.com/product.php?id=226, but sold under basically every fan brand in the US). I was able to buy them on ebay for about $25 and they have worked pretty well for me. My old ceiling fan remotes didn't have any memory... when you turned the relay on and off you had to grab the remote to turn the light / fan back on.

I purchased an extra remote and plan on hooking it up to an Arduino so that I can control the light and fan levels from Vera. There is a set of jumpers that let you choose one of 16 channels so one modified remote should be able to control 16 fans. I haven't had time to build or test this circuit yet, once I do I'll probably post more details on the forums.
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: davedecali on April 27, 2012, 11:52:04 am
get em while they are hot... 10 buy it now packs for $99... wish I needed more, but at this price you can't pass on this.

Going to test out to see if they are able to control other z wave outlets via the double click.  Still didn't find my answer.
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: PurdueGuy on April 27, 2012, 12:19:24 pm
These are not scene-capable, right?
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: kkl on April 27, 2012, 12:36:37 pm
They are supposed to be single-scene capable, but not via double-click.  See earlier post in this thread:  http://forum.micasaverde.com/index.php/topic,10295.msg70646.html#msg70646 (http://forum.micasaverde.com/index.php/topic,10295.msg70646.html#msg70646)
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: garrettwp on April 27, 2012, 12:43:42 pm
I decided to pick up some CA3000. Not sure what I will do with them, but for 99 bucks for 6 they can not be beat. I noticed he now has a a buy it now with out bidding. So it looks like who ever wants to pick some up can just use the buy it now with out fear of someone placing a bid. It looks like they come with ivory plates which I need. So I may put these in places that do not get a lot of use.

- Garrett
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: PurdueGuy on April 27, 2012, 12:51:44 pm
I caved and picked up some myself!

The item description says "Colors included white, ivory and almond" and "All switches come in white and include almond and ivory extra plates if color-change is desired."
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: davedecali on April 27, 2012, 12:54:25 pm
Yeah I finally found what I was looking for. Single scene capable is perfect.  Just needed the CA3000 to control the on/off function of a ceiling fan.  I have an evolve relay hooked up to the ceiling fan through the attic and wanted it on a wall switch.  The previous owner wired all the fans as hot and nothing was on a wall switch.  I know it will be expensive but contemplating running dual relays for fan and light and then double gang box the CA3000 for light and fan control. 
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: kkl on April 29, 2012, 05:06:38 pm
They are supposed to be single-scene capable

Has anyone gotten this to work, because I'm afraid it doesn't work with Vera.  I'm wondering if the Intouch remote doesn't do some sort of magic to make this happen.  Once I join a CA600 switch to Vera, the scene programming instruction of holding the switch to Off for 10 seconds doesn't do anything.  In fact, the LED doesn't seem to light at all once paired to Vera.  Not pairing the switch doesn't work either as it just flashes Blue & Red continuously.  Even the CA5100 doesn't appear to be able to control a scene directly.  Since the CA600 doesn't appear as a scene controller to Vera, you can use it to trigger an event, but nothing happens until the switch is polled - a very long delay.
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: PurdueGuy on April 29, 2012, 10:01:33 pm
For those discussing scenes, I was asking if the CA3000/CA600 were "scene capable"....not if they were capable of being mini scene controllers.  I don't want the switches to control anything, I want them to respond to scene controllers.

Leviton switches are "scene capable," meaning they will respond to "Scene A activate" messages from controllers.  Other switches, like GE, are not.  GEs will respond to "On" messages, but not Scene messages.
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: kkl on April 29, 2012, 10:57:23 pm
For those discussing scenes, I was asking if the CA3000/CA600 were "scene capable"....not if they were capable of being mini scene controllers.  I don't want the switches to control anything, I want them to respond to scene controllers.

Thanks for clarifying.  I didn't know there were different "scene signals".  I assume that this is still true from the wiki (http://wiki.micasaverde.com/index.php/ZWave_Add_Controller (http://wiki.micasaverde.com/index.php/ZWave_Add_Controller)):

Quote
For any commands in the scene that go to scene capable devices, namely Z-Wave scene capable light switches and lamp modules, Vera will program the scene controller or remote to talk directly to those scene capable devices. And, if the remote or scene controller has Up/Down or Off buttons, they will be sent directly to the scene capable devices. For any commands you assign to the scene which are not for scene-capable devices, like door locks, thermostats, non-scene capable lamp modules, etc., Vera will monitor the button pushes on your scene controller or handheld remote and automatically take care of the rest of the commands.

I didn't know that GE switches weren't scene capable, but I did find a reference to it.  I only have one, a 45609, and it responds to my Monster AVL300 remote directly.  I also just tested a scene programmed to an HA07, unplugged the Vera, and the switch still responded.  Does the problem only occur with dimming switches?  As far as the Intermatic switches are concerned, I know for sure that the HA14 and CA600 switches are scene-capable.  It is a little disappointing that the CA600 doesn't seem to be able to act as a single scene controller when used with the Vera.

Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: PurdueGuy on April 30, 2012, 12:08:34 am
I didn't know that GE switches weren't scene capable, but I did find a reference to it.  I only have one, a 45609, and it responds to my Monster AVL300 remote directly.  I also just tested a scene programmed to an HA07, unplugged the Vera, and the switch still responded.  Does the problem only occur with dimming switches?  As far as the Intermatic switches are concerned, I know for sure that the HA14 and CA600 switches are scene-capable.  It is a little disappointing that the CA600 doesn't seem to be able to act as a single scene controller when used with the Vera.
I think, but I'm not sure, that some handheld controllers are more intelligent, and Vera can program more into them.  Leviton scene/zone controllers (when programmed by Vera) will only talk directly to "scene-capable" devices for On...they can tell any device to turn off directly, if you associate them.  My GE remote can talk to any device directly.

If you use the Leviton handheld programmer (VRCPG), it can program Leviton scene/zone controllers to talk directly to non-Leviton devices, but only for On/Off.  It can program the controllers to send a multicast "On" so any device that you want will respond.  But you lose out on any adjustments...all devices are just sent "On" and "off" directly.   That means dimmers go to their last dimmed point, and you can't have any devices "Off" in the scene.  In a "Leviton Scene" you can have certain devices off, some off at full, some at 50%, etc.

It's a trade off, but since I got 5 "Monster" (really older Leviton) scene controllers via the sale, it's quite nice to be able to have the house react nearly instantaneously to the touch of a button.
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: oTi@ on April 30, 2012, 10:40:16 am
[...] CA600 [...] scene programming [...]
Just curious, could you post the Capabilities of the CA600 (and CA3000)?
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: kkl on April 30, 2012, 04:21:33 pm
From their manuals...

CA600
Quote
- Multiple location dimming when used with wireless accessory controls.
- Multiple location On/Off control using conventional 3-way or 4-way wiring and devices.
- Lights fade up or down turned on or off.
- Automatically returns to last level in the event of power fluctuations.
- Light levels can be set by pressing and holding the rocker until the desired light level is reached.
- Mini-scenes allows local control of connected load plus up to 5 additional Z-wave devices.
- Full 230 device scene control when used with Intermatic InTouchâ„¢ server .
- Dimmer always operates local load, does not require central control system.

CA3000
Quote
- Multiple location On/Off when used with wireless accessory controls.
- Multiple location On/Off control using conventional 3-way or 4-way wiring and devices.
- Mini-scenes allows local control of connected load plus up to 5 additional Z-wave devices.
- Full 230 device scene control when used with Intermatic InTouchâ„¢ server .
- Switch always operates local load, does not require central control system.
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: guessed on April 30, 2012, 05:06:25 pm
@kkl,
The Capabilities that oTi@ is referring to is the Z-Wave "Capabilities" string.  It's a long, comma-separated, list of #'s that formally identifies the specs of the devices.

You can see examples in posts like this one:
    http://forum.micasaverde.com/index.php/topic,9117.msg69259.html#msg69259
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: kkl on April 30, 2012, 06:30:36 pm
Oh?! :P  That obviously went right past me.  Here it is for the CA600.  I don't own the CA3000, but they're very similar other than the dimming function.

Capabilities201,12,0,4,17,1,L,R,RS,|38:1,39,114,115,133,134,145
Version6,2,9,1,101
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: PurdueGuy on May 02, 2012, 09:13:57 pm
In my quick testing this evening, it appears these devices are not "Scene capable" at least in the world of Leviton scenes.

I associated the new switch with a Leviton scene controller (VRCS1), in both directions.  If I configure the scene controller to do "area on/off" it will control the device.  However, if I set it up for a "scene" then nothing happens when I activate the scene.  However, if the device is on, when I deactivate the scene, it will turn it off.

Oh well...I only plan to use a couple of them to control fans/lights in rarely used parts of the house, so I can take the limitations.
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: kkl on May 04, 2012, 03:22:32 pm
PurdueGuy mentioned in another thread that he hadn't had a chance to check if the CA3000 supported "instant" status.  I was about to reply with a wrong answer, until I checked my switches.  To my surprise, the Intermatic Homesettings brand devices (HA14, HA03) do seem to support instant status, but the Intermatic Intouch CA600 does not.  I'm only going by what I see on the dashboard.  I'm surprised that the higher-end Intouch doesn't.
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: PurdueGuy on May 04, 2012, 03:50:37 pm
My CA3000 does report status instantly, at least 90% of the time.

I don't have it installed in its actual location yet, I just have it wired in an enclosure.  It was also unplugged during the last heal, so it doesn't have a route to Vera, so I assume sometimes the notice makes it to Vera, and sometimes not.  (I just moved the switch close to Vera, and it worked 100% of the time...granted, that was only about 10 toggles!)

I do not have a CA600 to test.

I do have Intermatic HomeSettings outlets (HA01s), and those also report to Vera instantly.

I know MCV used some "special sauce" to make things work even on devices that don't have "instant status"...but I'm not sure if it works for everything.  I can see it working for devices that support associations, but GE & Intermatic (HomeSettings that is) devices do not, and yet Vera still gets notified instantly.  I think the device do a broadcast of "hey, look, I just turned on" to any device within range.  If Vera can see that, then it knows, but that message won't be routed through other nodes to reach Vera, like it would be if the 2 devices were actually associated.

My CA3000s DO support associations, so I would think instant-status will work even when not in range, but I could be completely wrong.
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: kkl on May 04, 2012, 04:02:38 pm
Thanks for the interesting and helpful explanation.  I just looked at this table, http://store.homeseer.com/store/HomeSeer-Z-Wave-Dimming-Wall-Switch-Matrix-W16.aspx (http://store.homeseer.com/store/HomeSeer-Z-Wave-Dimming-Wall-Switch-Matrix-W16.aspx), which says that HomeSettings don't support instant status, so your explanation makes sense.  I would be really surprised if the CA3000 supports it, but the CA600 doesn't, since they're so similar, but I'm not seeing it work today.

Have you been able to figure out how to use the CA3000 as a single-scene control or get it to control a group of switches? 
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: PurdueGuy on May 04, 2012, 04:05:11 pm
Have you been able to figure out how to use the CA3000 as a single-scene control or get it to control a group of switches?
I tried for a little while, but that's not my intended purpose, so I didn't try too hard.

But the instructions say "start with the switch off, and hold the off for 10 seconds" until the LED blinks/turns blue.  No matter how long I tried, I never got it to do that. 

I removed associations, power cycled, etc. but nothing would get the blue LED.  I don't have an InTouch base, so that might be required, even though the instructions didn't say that.
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: kkl on May 04, 2012, 04:22:07 pm
But the instructions say "start with the switch off, and hold the off for 10 seconds" until the LED blinks/turns blue.  No matter how long I tried, I never got it to do that. 

I discovered that early on.  I've got a trouble-ticket in with MCV about it, but it takes awhile when you only get a response every few days.
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: kkl on May 04, 2012, 06:15:19 pm
From the Homeseer forum (http://board.homeseer.com/showpost.php?p=986940&postcount=10):
Quote
The CA600 is not listing in the matrix since it went out of production in 2007. It does not support instant status and has some serious issues. We carried the switch in our store back in 2006 but only for a couple months. If you'd like more help or want more detailed information, just give us a call.

Hmm...
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: PurdueGuy on May 04, 2012, 07:28:33 pm
Hmm indeed!  I guess they don't want anything in writing??

I just installed the CA3000s in a bathroom. Dang they are LOUD!!  I know relays clicks, but on a scale of 1-10, with GEs and Levitons being an arbitrary 7, these CA3000s are probably a 15!  I live alone, so I can probably deal, but the thought of that loud SNAP in the middle of the night will probably force me to switch them to Levitons.
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: Video321 on May 04, 2012, 08:16:33 pm
I just installed the CA3000s in a bathroom. Dang they are LOUD!!  I know relays clicks, but on a scale of 1-10, with GEs and Levitons being an arbitrary 7, these CA3000s are probably a 15!  I live alone, so I can probably deal, but the thought of that loud SNAP in the middle of the night will probably force me to switch them to Levitons.
Yes, they are loud and that was my first impression as well - I was like... damn!!! However, for me, considering I could get 4 of them vs. 1 Leviton and I have a small install I could live with the no feedback issue and a loud relay. My bedrooms though all have the dimmers which don't click at all so no issues there.

This is my first install with Z-Wave so I would love to know what the "serious issues" were that HomeSeer were eluding to.
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: highbrian on May 05, 2012, 06:02:00 pm
PM me for details
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: Aaron on May 05, 2012, 06:10:43 pm
PM me for details

why not just post in the forum so everyone can gain?
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: BOFH on May 05, 2012, 08:40:08 pm
I got my set of 3 CA3000 / 3 CA600 in the other day and installed 2 dimmers and one switch so far.
The switches sure are loud compared to my GE/Jasco units but I can live with that considering the price.

Right now I'm scratching my head as I can't get a CA3000 to work in my guest bathroom. It's sharing a double gang with a GFI outlet and gets it's neutral/line from the outlet. (Don't ask, house was built in '72 and although the wiring is solid and 12gauge all around, the structuring is weird.)

Whatever I do, the GFI trips every time I attempt to switch the CA3000 lights on. The led on the CA3000 lights up correctly though. For test purposes I wired the light directly into the GFI outlets and no problems. Confirming what my multi meter told me  with regards to continuity. The weird thing is that it all works when putting the standard 2 pin switch back in. I need the outlet and don't want to have a non GFI outlet next to that sink so for now it's no zwave there.

Anybody else experience issues with these and GFI outlets?

I put that CA3000 in another location and it's working fine. I have a GE/Jasco switch in the master bathroom in the exact same configuration and there is no issues there.
   
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: hugheaves on May 07, 2012, 10:15:07 am
Just as an FYI, both the CA3000 and CA600 devices report that they support COMMAND_CLASS_ASSOCIATION.

It appears that Vera registers itself to receive events via the association, and when I operate the switches, the new switch state is received immediately by Vera:

42   05/07/12 10:01:25.677   0x1 0x9 0x0 0x4 0x0 0x2f 0x3 0x20 0x1 0x0 0xff (#####/# ###) <0x2c187680>
24   05/07/12 10:01:25.677   ZWaveSerial::ReceiveData got frame type 0x0 command id 0x4 m_iFrameID 97 gwf_ach <0x2c187680>
41   05/07/12 10:01:25.678   ACK: 0x6 (#) <0x2c187680>
24   05/07/12 10:01:25.696   ZWaveSerial::ReceivedFrame holding the srm mutex for m_iFrameID 97 gwf_ach <0x2c187680>
24   05/07/12 10:01:25.697   ZWaveSerial::ReceivedFrame receive data not waiting for frame: (nil)/null ack -1 expect 0 good 0 type 0 cmd:4/0 gd: 1 m_pRes (nil) m_pReq (nil) resp REQUEST pzw->m_c 0x4 m_iFrameID 97 gwf_ach <0x2c187680>
10   05/07/12 10:01:25.697   AlarmManager::AddRelativeAlarm current time 1336399285 delay 0 type 52 <0x2c187680>
10   05/07/12 10:01:25.697   AlarmManager::AddAbsoluteAlarm alarm 0x6f52e8 entry 0xd79138 id 84 type 52 param=0xd3e6d8 entry->when: 1336399285 time: 1336399285 bCancelFirst 0=0 <0x2c187680>
31   05/07/12 10:01:25.698   AlarmManager::Run 0x6f52e8 notified of a change entry 0x8e7f48 id 79 deleted 0 <0x2b987680>
31   05/07/12 10:01:25.698   AlarmManager::Run callback for alarm 0x6f52e8 entry 0xd79138 type 52 id 84 param=0xd3e6d8 entry->when: 1336399285 time: 1336399285 tnum: 1 slow 0 tardy 0 <0x2b987680>
24   05/07/12 10:01:25.698   ZWaveJobHandler::DoReceivedFrame m_iFrameID 97 gwf_ach node 47 command 0x4 data  <0x2b987680>
24   05/07/12 10:01:25.699   ZWaveNode::HandlePollUpdate node 47 device 194 class 0x20 command 0x1 m_iFrameID 97/9567816 data 0x0 (#) <0x2b987680>
02   05/07/12 10:01:25.699   ZWaveNode::HandlePollUpdate_Basic_Set node 47 device 194 unhandled <0x2b987680>
24   05/07/12 10:01:25.699   ZWaveJobHandler::DoReceivedFrame m_iFrameID 97 done 1 <0x2b987680>


However, Vera doesn't appear to actually do anything with the data. The Vera device state is not updated, and no scenes are triggered.  (I'm wondering if the "ZWaveNode::HandlePollUpdate_Basic_Set node 47 device 194 unhandled" message points to the reason)

Anyway, I've reported this as a bug to see if MCV can determine if this is a hardware bug, software bug, or just some feature I don't understand. :)

Hugh
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: kkl on May 07, 2012, 02:29:32 pm

Anyway, I've reported this as a bug to see if MCV can determine if this is a hardware bug, software bug, or just some feature I don't understand. :)

Thanks for reporting this.  I had submitted a request to try to get the switch working as a scene controller which it's supposed to be able to do.  After a week of waiting, I received an answer of quoting the manual that I need the CA5500B hand-held remote.  Of course, the manual doesn't list any method of controlling the switch other than using Intermatic's controller, so that was useless.  Maybe there is something proprietary about the communication, but it would have been nice if Vera could duplicate it.

PurdueGuy reported that his switch status gets updated immediately in Vera's UI.  Like yours, mine don't.  I wonder what the difference is?
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: PurdueGuy on May 07, 2012, 02:37:16 pm
PurdueGuy reported that his switch status gets updated immediately in Vera's UI.  Like yours, mine don't.  I wonder what the difference is?

Are your devices in direct communication with Vera?  I installed another device this weekend, I'll test it to see if it reports immediately.  I could be luck of the draw??
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: kkl on May 07, 2012, 03:28:29 pm
Are your devices in direct communication with Vera?
Sorry, I don't know what you mean.
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: oTi@ on May 07, 2012, 03:36:55 pm
Capabilities201,12,0,4,17,1,L,R,RS,|38:1,39,114,115,133,134,145
Thanks! Doesn't look like it supports true scenes (as @PurdueGuy meant); but does support associations (presumably to configure which devices are part of the scene) and a proprietary set of commands. So possibly a proprietary way of implementing the scenes they talk about.
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: PurdueGuy on May 07, 2012, 03:42:44 pm
Are your devices in direct communication with Vera?
Sorry, I don't know what you mean.

Can Vera talk directly to the device, not routing through another device?
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: kkl on May 07, 2012, 03:58:43 pm
Are your devices in direct communication with Vera?
Sorry, I don't know what you mean.

Can Vera talk directly to the device, not routing through another device?
If that's the same as being neighbors, then yes, the switches and Vera are neighbors to each other.
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: homejones on May 07, 2012, 06:27:03 pm
Very curious - what is the minimum load for these dimmers? I wonder whether a group of 6-8 Ecosmart 9.5W LED bulbs in recessed cans would effectively dim...?

I know these are incandescent dimmers, but I remember reading somewhere that some LED bulbs would work with incandescent dimmers as long as there was a minimum load.

Thanks!
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: PurdueGuy on May 07, 2012, 08:25:47 pm
I just checked the two CA3000s that I have installed.  They are installed on the same box in the bathroom.

I checked with the Leviton programmer, and both are associated with Vera.

When Vera is in its usual spot (top of the stairs) the updates are NOT reported in the GUI.  When I moved Vera to the same room, the updates were immediate.   It looks like they don't have a route back to Vera for asynchronous messages?  (Vera probably includes a route back when sending messages, so they node knows how to reply/ACK).

For testing, I turned on verbose logging and disabled polling, then waited for the logging to calm down.

Note: I get an "unhanded event" even when it works, but in the "works" log, it looks like Vera immediately does a poll?  *shrug*

Feel free to inspect the attached logs!
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: hugheaves on May 07, 2012, 08:50:04 pm
Note: I get an "unhanded event" even when it works, but in the "works" log, it looks like Vera immediately does a poll?  *shrug*

Interesting, thanks for the additional data.

I find my CA3000's sometimes report immediately as well. When they do work, I see a "node NNN status 0x84 not expected, polling instead..." message. I also see the same message in your working log, but not in your non-working log, so maybe that has something to do with it as well:

24   05/07/12 17:12:14.969   ZWaveNode::HandleApplicationUpdate node 100 status 0x84  not expected, polling instead config 1 last attempt 1336435934 <0x803>
10   05/07/12 17:12:14.971   Job::Job created <0xbd4360> name job#84 :pollnode_hau #100 (0xbd4360) <0x803>


Without access to the LuaUPnP source code, and the Z-Wave NDA covered specs, I guess I'll be relying on MCV to figure this one out. :(

Hugh
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: oTi@ on May 08, 2012, 01:12:10 am
If the device supports associations, Vera might always try to associate herself.

Has anybody tried associating another dimmer or switch into group 1 of the Intermatic's, just to see if that does anything?

Like most manufacturers, they are probably not allowed to report instant status. I believe the workaround for that is the devices (like these, GE, Evolve, etc.) (re-)broadcast their capabilities (that's the 0x84, followed by what includes the supported command classes). If Vera didn't expect this frame (as opposed to when being in inclusion mode), she interprets this as an indicator of a state change and goes out and polls the device.
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: kkl on May 08, 2012, 12:05:16 pm
Has anybody tried associating another dimmer or switch into group 1 of the Intermatic's, just to see if that does anything?
Hey, it worked!  I know that I had tried this before, but since I really don't understand this stuff, I had probably messed it up.  I set an association of one CA600 switch with another.  Lo and behold, when I turned on that switch, it also turned on the other.  Once the association is set-up, the switches must communicate directly, as there was no activity in the Vera log or the UI.  I tried a second switch for testing, and it also worked, including controlling a Homesettings brand switch.

Procedure:
In the configuration for the 'control' switch, select the Device Options tab.
Under Group ID, enter "1" then select "Add group"
Select "Set" and choose the other devices to be controlled
Close the dialog box, click Save and Continue
Wait...



 
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: aschwalb on May 08, 2012, 02:01:39 pm
Has anybody tried associating another dimmer or switch into group 1 of the Intermatic's, just to see if that does anything?
Hey, it worked!  I know that I had tried this before, but since I really don't understand this stuff, I had probably messed it up.  I set an association of one CA600 switch with another.  Lo and behold, when I turned on that switch, it also turned on the other.  Once the association is set-up, the switches must communicate directly, as there was no activity in the Vera log or the UI.  I tried a second switch for testing, and it also worked, including controlling a Homesettings brand switch.

Procedure:
In the configuration for the 'control' switch, select the Device Options tab.
Under Group ID, enter "1" then select "Add group"
Select "Set" and choose the other devices to be controlled
Close the dialog box, click Save and Continue
Wait...

And I think it matters if the device you want to control is either on or off....  when you setup the associations.  I *think* that the behavior will be opposite depending on the state of the controlled device when associated... @kkl can you confirm?  I bought these swtiches as well but will be a few weeks before I can time to play with them. 
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: PurdueGuy on May 09, 2012, 01:53:50 am
My tests were by no means exhaustive, but I didn't see a difference in the state of the light vs the outcome.

Whether each light was on or off didn't matter.  Turning the "main" switch on made all the others I had associated with it turn on (Leviton, GE, & another CA3000).  I started with the Leviton and GE on, and the CA3000 off.  They stayed in sync*.

* = only presses of the "main" switch caused the other associated switches to turn on or off.  A Z-wave command to the switch caused *only* the main switch to turn on or off.  If the switch was on, and I pressed "on" again, then the other lights jumped back in sync.

I do not have any CA600s to test, but I tested with a Leviton VRI06.  I'm obviously too tired to figure out the pattern.  It seems to "learn" whatever the dimmer is set to when the "main" switch turns on (even if the dimmer isn't on).  From then on, for the duration of the time the "main" switch is on, any time you press "on" again, the dimmer seems to go to the same preset level.  Turn the "main" switch off, adjust the dimmer to another position, and turn the "main" switch back on...the dimmer now has a new "default" level.

Or am I tired and making no sense??   ???
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: aschwalb on May 09, 2012, 09:06:09 am
My tests were by no means exhaustive, but I didn't see a difference in the state of the light vs the outcome.

I may be (likely) confusing this with some ATC Homepro switches I had... 
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: waltzer11 on May 09, 2012, 02:31:22 pm
can you guys clue me in regarding electrical wiring of the CA3000. my existing standard on/off switch has 2 wires connected to it; one coming from the circuit breaker (line) and another going to the light (load i guess). they are both black. there are several white wires tied together and black wires also tied together - the outdoor food lights share with this same circuit breaker. CA3000 has 5 wires: white, black, blue, green and yellow. can i just tie the white to the wire going to the light and the black coming from the circuit breaker. do i need the green, yellow and blue? thanks.
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: PurdueGuy on May 09, 2012, 02:36:47 pm
can you guys clue me in regarding electrical wiring of the CA3000. my existing standard on/off switch has 2 wires connected to it; one coming from the circuit breaker (line) and another going to the light (load i guess). they are both black. there are several white wires tied together and black wires also tied together - the outdoor food lights share with this same circuit breaker. CA3000 has 5 wires: white, black, blue, green and yellow. can i just tie the white to the wire going to the light and the black coming from the circuit breaker. do i need the green, yellow and blue? thanks.
Is this a single switch to control the light?

Assuming the whites are neutral (big assumption lately!) then, you would do
CA3000 white to box white
CA3000 black to box black (from circuit breaker)
CA3000 blue to box black (load)
CA3000 green to ground
CA3000 yellow is unused
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: waltzer11 on May 09, 2012, 03:52:25 pm
can you guys clue me in regarding electrical wiring of the CA3000. my existing standard on/off switch has 2 wires connected to it; one coming from the circuit breaker (line) and another going to the light (load i guess). they are both black. there are several white wires tied together and black wires also tied together - the outdoor food lights share with this same circuit breaker. CA3000 has 5 wires: white, black, blue, green and yellow. can i just tie the white to the wire going to the light and the black coming from the circuit breaker. do i need the green, yellow and blue? thanks.
Is this a single switch to control the light? yes this is a single switch to control the light

Assuming the whites are neutral (big assumption lately!) then, you would do
CA3000 white to box white. do you mean just tap the CA3000 white to all the white wires tied together?
CA3000 black to box black (from circuit breaker). this is clear and straight forward
CA3000 blue to box black (load). clear and straight forward
CA3000 green to ground. clear.
CA3000 yellow is unused. clear

so i am only confused with the CA3000 white to box white (the first one). thanks again.

Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: PurdueGuy on May 09, 2012, 04:45:02 pm
In theory, yes.  That bundle of white wires *should* be coming in from the panel and branching out to all the other destinations.

A few questions....
How many switches are in the box?  (More than one, I'm guessing?)
How many "sets" of wires are there?  (You would usually have one in from the breaker, one to each set of items being controlled, and possible a final set out to providing line and neutral to another location.)
To verify, the LINE from the breaker is part of a set that has a white line into the bundle?
To verify, the LOAD to the light is part of a set that has a white line into the bundle?
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: waltzer11 on May 09, 2012, 05:36:20 pm
In theory, yes.  That bundle of white wires *should* be coming in from the panel and branching out to all the other destinations.

A few questions....
How many switches are in the box?  (More than one, I'm guessing?)
How many "sets" of wires are there?  (You would usually have one in from the breaker, one to each set of items being controlled, and possible a final set out to providing line and neutral to another location.)
To verify, the LINE from the breaker is part of a set that has a white line into the bundle?
To verify, the LOAD to the light is part of a set that has a white line into the bundle?

thank you again. there are 2 switches in the box; 1 for the ceiling fan (i am only controlling the lights in the fan, which has 2 pull cords; 1 for the light and another for the fan). the other switch is for the flood lights in the backyard. these 2 switches share the same circuit breaker. ok, i will check the sets of wire tomorrow and verify the LINE and the LOAD from your description. thanks for your help and will let you know.
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: oTi@ on May 10, 2012, 08:08:46 am
And I think it matters if the device you want to control is either on or off....
My tests were by no means exhaustive, [...]
I'd expect programming the association is just that. I suppose you could try setting up an association with a device that's powered down.

The last dim level is kept locally in the device. The controller just tells it to go to that last dim level (as opposed to a set level, or on).

Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: DaveGee on May 10, 2012, 05:32:16 pm
Assuming the whites are neutral (big assumption lately!)

You're telling ME! :)

My previous home had a box with three switches and it had loads from not 1 not 2 but THREE different breakers in the panel... Make for some real -fun- when you turn the ... 'boxes breaker' off and think... Okay now it's safe to work!   :o

Lucky for me I was hammered in at a very early age to only use one hand when working on a box you don't know the full history of.
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: Video321 on May 10, 2012, 10:52:45 pm
Lucky for me I was hammered in at a very early age to only use one hand when working on a box you don't know the full history of.
Or buy a sensor to check for live wires...
I'm so paranoid I still use it on my own home with boxes that I know.
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: syyid on May 11, 2012, 12:28:33 pm
Very curious - what is the minimum load for these dimmers? I wonder whether a group of 6-8 Ecosmart 9.5W LED bulbs in recessed cans would effectively dim...?

I know these are incandescent dimmers, but I remember reading somewhere that some LED bulbs would work with incandescent dimmers as long as there was a minimum load.

Thanks!
I tried it with 4x18W FEIT LED lights and it didn't work. If turned off, the lights would flicker. I also tested it with 4x8.5W LEDs and had the same issue.
FWIW I have GE (4560x) Dimmers that control both successfully
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: garrettwp on May 11, 2012, 12:40:11 pm
Any way to have the led on the CA3000 come on when the light is off? Similar to what the levitons do? This would allow to see the switch at night time.

- Garrett
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: BOFH on May 13, 2012, 09:16:46 am
My GE/JASCO switches/dimmers to the same thing and I prefer that . The CA600/CA3000 do not do this out of the box it seems. I could have sworn I read a while back you could send the CA600/CA3000 a command to introduce that behaviour but I can't find that article at this time.

Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: Aaron on May 13, 2012, 08:32:09 pm
Give intermatic support a call and they might just give you the full internals docs if you ask nicely.  I have done this with products in the past with good results.
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: DaveGee on May 15, 2012, 05:32:53 pm
Okay color me stumped...

I have a standard 2way switch ... Standard home hallway..

Line --> Switch1 <---3 wires ---> Ceiling Fixture <--- 3 wires ---> Switch2

Switch1 has:
   A 2 wire + ground from brakerbox
   A 3 wire + ground going to the ceiling fixture (black white red)

Ceiling Fixture has:
 The 3 wire bundle from SW1
 Anither 3 wire bundle going to SW1

switch2 has:
 The 3 wire from the ceiling fixture.

My issue is how do a do this?

Can I use 2 ca600's ... I didnt think I could us two ca600's in the same switch/fixture circuit.

I also have ca3000's but the need a neutral don't they? And the 3 wire from the fixture doesn't contain a neutral the white wire is actually a hot I think.

I also have the ca5300 ?? Companion switch however that too seems to want a neutral...

Can this not be put together given I have available ca600s , ca3000s & ca5100s (?) ???   
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: kkl on May 15, 2012, 06:17:38 pm
Three-way circuits can be wired in many non-standard ways.  Can you tell from this page, http://www.homeimprovementweb.com/information/how-to/three-way-switch.htm (http://www.homeimprovementweb.com/information/how-to/three-way-switch.htm), which type you have?  Sounds like you might have Option 3.  Sometimes the white wire is used as a traveler; it's common to mark it with black electrical tape when this is done.

Quote
Can I use 2 ca600's ... I didnt think I could us two ca600's in the same switch/fixture circuit.
  That's right - only one per circuit.  Any other switches are the standard variety.

Quote
I also have ca3000's but the need a neutral don't they? And the 3 wire from the fixture doesn't contain a neutral the white wire is actually a hot I think.
  Yes, the CA3000 needs a neutral, and a neutral also needs to return from the light.  Depending on your wiring, this might still be possible.

Quote
I also have the ca5300 ?? Companion switch however that too seems to want a neutral...
  I assume you mean the CA5100.  Yes, it also needs a neutral.  I converted a 3-switch circuit to a 2-switch circuit originating from a CA600 by bypassing the middle switch and using a CA5100 in its place.  If you only have single switches in the SW1 and SW2 box, presumably you have a neutral coming in with the line (power).  Again, it might be possible to use a CA5100 depending on the available wires.







Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: DaveGee on May 15, 2012, 08:30:15 pm
Yep... It's number 3 ... Power to the switch then 3 wire to overhead then 3 wire to the far switch. In fact I'm 99% sure it's from a switch located in a walkin closet located behind the wall in the hall where the switch is.  It dawned on me when I saw three sets of 2 wires entering the closet light switch.
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: kkl on May 15, 2012, 08:39:47 pm
I think the attached diagram will work for you.  I'm no electrician, so proceed at your own risk.  The controversy, as far as I'm concerned, is what type of standard switch to use.  I prefer to use a standard single-pole switch when there is only one additional switch with the CA600/3000.  If your instructions don't show this, see attachment from this post:  http://forum.micasaverde.com/index.php/topic,10295.msg70601.html#msg70601 (http://forum.micasaverde.com/index.php/topic,10295.msg70601.html#msg70601).  From my experience, it's too easy to screw up the jumpered three-way switch, and some of us have had problems even when everything is wired correctly.  I have also used a three-way switch without a jumper as per the HA14 wiring diagram (http://forum.micasaverde.com/index.php/topic,10295.msg71020.html#msg71020 (http://forum.micasaverde.com/index.php/topic,10295.msg71020.html#msg71020)).
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: DaveGee on May 15, 2012, 10:10:02 pm
Thanks for the post it really helped untangle the mess that I always find myself in WRT 3ways.  ;D

Question is...  would I be able to use the CA5100 at that SW2 local?  I was certain that saw read or was led to believe that that was one of its primary reasons for being ... Since is doesn't actually control a load of its own.  If not ten I got about 6 of those suckers that I've got no use for.

Using an traditional switch isn't the end of the world but all things being equal I'd rather have an intermatic switches.

Anyway thanks again for all the help!
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: kkl on May 16, 2012, 12:36:00 am
Yes, it looks to me like you have adequate wiring to do that (see attachment).  In this scenario, your CA600 would be wired as a single switch with the yellow wire unused.  You would use the white wire to connect the neutral at the light and the CA5100.  You could use the red (or black) wire to pass the line (hot) through to the 5100.  I have one CA5100 that I was able to associate with a CA600, but I have not been able to get it to dim - just off/on. 
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: DaveGee on May 16, 2012, 09:07:28 am
This is great... Your help is much appreciated!  ;D

I think I'll try and make up a pack of graphics that details all these things (with your permission) and try to put it in the wiki.  I'd give credit of course AND put a mega disclaimer that these instructions  are for entertainment purposes only yadda yadda etc etc etc.

Thanks again!
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: kkl on May 16, 2012, 09:09:08 am
Glad to help.  If you want to post about this in the wiki, that would be great.
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: syyid on May 16, 2012, 09:26:03 am
Do you guys know if there's a way to directly associate a switch (CA3000) with a motion detector (intermatic CA9000). I have a scene setup but there's a delay of 2-3 seconds between the detector being tripped and the switch flipping. I vaguely recall something about groups related to that but can't find the specifics
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: swazi on May 16, 2012, 09:39:19 am
One of the ca3000 switches I installed stopped controlling the load. The red led is rapidly flashing. It was working the one moment and a little later started the flashing. This happened about 3 days after installation. I have not even included it in the network yet.
Any idea what the red flashing means?
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: aschwalb on May 16, 2012, 10:38:21 am
Any idea what the red flashing means?

That it's broken?  ;D  Sorry couldn't help myself.  I have found that sometimes removing power to the switch (i.e. trip the breaker) can reset them.  Also forcing an exclude from Vera might as well. 
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: Aaron on May 16, 2012, 02:32:57 pm
Anyone figure out how to get the LED to light up when the switch is off?
Title: Re: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: swazi on May 17, 2012, 01:36:20 pm
Any idea what the red flashing means?

That it's broken?  ;D  Sorry couldn't help myself.  I have found that sometimes removing power to the switch (i.e. trip the breaker) can reset them.  Also forcing an exclude from Vera might as well.

Thanks that worked. I was just wondering why I could not find a manual with error codes that explained the meaning of the led flicker
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: waltzer11 on May 17, 2012, 06:32:02 pm
In theory, yes.  That bundle of white wires *should* be coming in from the panel and branching out to all the other destinations.

A few questions....
How many switches are in the box?  (More than one, I'm guessing?)
How many "sets" of wires are there?  (You would usually have one in from the breaker, one to each set of items being controlled, and possible a final set out to providing line and neutral to another location.)
To verify, the LINE from the breaker is part of a set that has a white line into the bundle?
To verify, the LOAD to the light is part of a set that has a white line into the bundle?
thanks PurdueGuy, following your instructions, i just installed 2 CA3000 and i can manually operate the switch on/off successfully. the only problem is that the ceiling fan does not work anymore,  only the ceiling fan light turns on/off. i have not paired the switches with vera2 yet.
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: waltzer11 on May 19, 2012, 10:32:39 am
Thanks for posting this, radar.

I just noticed this thread this morning, and there was a CA3000 pack with no bids, so I bought it.  I already have 3 of these for ceiling fans and they work great.  Under $20/each is a good deal.

hi, i just installed CA3000 for my ceiling fan - only the lights of the fan turns on/off; the fan is not moving at all. i followed PurdueGuy's instruction below. i would appreciate if you can give me some hint with your "hook-up". thanks.

Assuming the whites are neutral (big assumption lately!) then, you would do
CA3000 white to box white
CA3000 black to box black (from circuit breaker)
CA3000 blue to box black (load)
CA3000 green to ground
CA3000 yellow is unused
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: garrettwp on May 19, 2012, 10:53:57 am
Not to sound rude, but are both the lights and fan suppose to turn on at the same time? Did you check to make sure the fan is on at the fan itself? What was in there prior t adding the new switch?

- Garrett
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: waltzer11 on May 19, 2012, 11:21:38 am
Not to sound rude, but are both the lights and fan suppose to turn on at the same time? Did you check to make sure the fan is on at the fan itself? What was in there prior t adding the new switch?

- Garrett

prior to installing the CA3000, i had a regular on/off switch. the fan and the lights has their own separate pull cords. the cord for the light is now on so that when i turn the CA3000 "on" the lights come on. i pulled the fan cord several times and nothing happens. will probably restore the old switch to find out if the fan will work. thanks for your input.
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: garrettwp on May 19, 2012, 11:40:51 am
I would also double check your connections on the CA3000 to make sure everything is hooked up correctly.

- Garrett
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: aschwalb on May 21, 2012, 10:17:21 am
prior to installing the CA3000, i had a regular on/off switch. the fan and the lights has their own separate pull cords. the cord for the light is now on so that when i turn the CA3000 "on" the lights come on. i pulled the fan cord several times and nothing happens. will probably restore the old switch to find out if the fan will work. thanks for your input.

Make sure there wasn't also a red wire in the box.  It could have wired so that the black and red were tied together on your regular switch.  Black maybe being light and red being used for fan power.  If that *IS* the case then tie them together again and attach it to the blue wire. 
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: jster on May 23, 2012, 08:27:19 am
PM me for details

Can you please post the details on what the issues are? Thanks!
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: waltzer11 on May 23, 2012, 10:37:35 am
PM me for details

Can you please post the details on what the issues are? Thanks!

below is my post last May 9th. i had a regular on/off switch for the ceiling fan/light which has a pull chain for the fan and and another puul chain for the fan. i replaced this regular switch with CA3000. only the light turns on/off and nothing happen with fan. anyway thanks for all your help. fanlink, leviton, GE are all expensive. i think i will just buy a receiver (for inside the fan canopy) and wall transmitter from home depot - they are not zwave but only $32.95. i will just settle for non zwave for now since i use only the fan during the summer time. thanks guys.


Quote from: waltzer11 on May 09, 2012, 02:31:22 pm

    can you guys clue me in regarding electrical wiring of the CA3000. my existing standard on/off switch has 2 wires connected to it; one coming from the circuit breaker (line) and another going to the light (load i guess). they are both black. there are several white wires tied together and black wires also tied together - the outdoor food lights share with this same circuit breaker. CA3000 has 5 wires: white, black, blue, green and yellow. can i just tie the white to the wire going to the light and the black coming from the circuit breaker. do i need the green, yellow and blue? thanks.

Is this a single switch to control the light?

Assuming the whites are neutral (big assumption lately!) then, you would do
CA3000 white to box white
CA3000 black to box black (from circuit breaker)
CA3000 blue to box black (load)
CA3000 green to ground
CA3000 yellow is unused
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: DaveGee on May 24, 2012, 06:30:11 am
Quote
"My existing standard on/off switch has 2 wires connected to it; one coming from the circuit breaker (line) and another going to the light (load i guess)."

Okay... So here's a question for you.  The standard switch on the wall.. When it was turned on/off did it only control the lights portion?  In other words with the switch on the wall in the off position, pulling the chain on the lights didn't change the lights right?

Now what about the fan? With the old switch installed when the old switch was off did the fan still function when the chain was pulled. OR...

Did it work like this..  If the lights and fan were running flipping the old switch off turned off  the light AND the fan?

What I'm trying to determine is if power was 'always on' for the fan section.

Quote
"They are both black. there are several white wires tied together and black wires also tied together - the outdoor food lights share with this same circuit breaker."

When you have two or more green/bare (ground wires) tied together it's normal.

When you have two or more white  (neutral wires) tied together it's normal.

When you have two or more black (live/load wires) tied together it ( usually ) means one of those black wires is hot ( from the load center ) and power travels unhampered / unswitched to the rest of the blacks in the bundle ... Unless one of those wires actually came from a switch in the bov.  If that's the case then the hot coming from the load center is going into the switch and the 'switched' end of the switch connects with the bundle and when the switch is off all the blacks in the bundle turn off.

What I'd do first is ensure ALL the whites in the box ( that are tied together ) are indeed nice and tightly connected under the wire nut..  Then I'd do the same for the black bundle...  Perhaps even if you hadn't touched either wire nut a wire may have been dislodged and no longer making good contact... This alone might be the problem..  As always.... Make sure you do the inspection and 'retightening' of the cable bundles with the breaker off ... and do them one at a time so not to mix things up.
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: oTi@ on May 24, 2012, 08:34:26 am
@waltzer11,

I think you should be able to get it to behave with the CA3000 the same way it did before with the old switch. As @DaveGee mentioned, the switch on the wall may switch the feed to both the fan and the lights. The pull chains determine fan on/off, lights on/off. That doesn't change.
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: DaveGee on May 24, 2012, 09:02:44 am
The issue isn't the switch working or not.. I think the issue he's having is this:

Prior to putting in the new switch the light and the fan both worked.

Now after the new switch install only the lighs are working.

So given the lights are working and can be turned on and off from BOTH the new switch AND the pull chain (please confirm) then we know the new switch is indeed controlling the flow of electricity to the ceiling.

IF my statement above is correct the fan NOT working can only be one of a few problems.

1 the fan motor died ... Aka just bad luck / timing.

2 the pull chain that acts as a 2nd control to the fan operation died... Again just bad timing...

3 the fan and the light were both being fed UNIQUE power feeds from the wall switch and one getting power to the fan isn't connected to the blue wire on the new switch instead only the wire feeding power to the lights is connected.

I think it's most important to see that switch in the wall is actually doing anything at all so my advice would be to use the pull chain to light the fan and then turn the wall switch off.

If the light goes out it'll go a long way in sleuthing out the problem. If the light doesn't ... Well that too will help us get a better read as to how that fan is wired.

Remember as much as I wish it weren't true, the power from the load center doesn't have to go to the switch box first... The power could just as easily wired into the ceiling first and then sent down to the wall switch.

To get even nuttier if the power does go to the fixture first then its also possible to wire the lights to be unaffected by the wall switch / aka always on aka only controllable via the local pull chain and them just the fans power would be switched by the wall switch.

Now if that last statement were the case / true then all bets are off and either the new wall switch is bad and/or miswired.

With so very many ways a fixture could be wired it's really important to consider all the possibilities until we can better identify how your specific fan is wired.
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: waltzer11 on May 24, 2012, 11:43:32 am
The issue isn't the switch working or not.. I think the issue he's having is this:

Prior to putting in the new switch the light and the fan both worked.

Now after the new switch install only the lighs are working.

So given the lights are working and can be turned on and off from BOTH the new switch AND the pull chain (please confirm) then we know the new switch is indeed controlling the flow of electricity to the ceiling.

IF my statement above is correct the fan NOT working can only be one of a few problems.

1 the fan motor died ... Aka just bad luck / timing.

2 the pull chain that acts as a 2nd control to the fan operation died... Again just bad timing...

3 the fan and the light were both being fed UNIQUE power feeds from the wall switch and one getting power to the fan isn't connected to the blue wire on the new switch instead only the wire feeding power to the lights is connected.

I think it's most important to see that switch in the wall is actually doing anything at all so my advice would be to use the pull chain to light the fan and then turn the wall switch off.

If the light goes out it'll go a long way in sleuthing out the problem. If the light doesn't ... Well that too will help us get a better read as to how that fan is wired.

Remember as much as I wish it weren't true, the power from the load center doesn't have to go to the switch box first... The power could just as easily wired into the ceiling first and then sent down to the wall switch.

To get even nuttier if the power does go to the fixture first then its also possible to wire the lights to be unaffected by the wall switch / aka always on aka only controllable via the local pull chain and them just the fans power would be switched by the wall switch.

Now if that last statement were the case / true then all bets are off and either the new wall switch is bad and/or miswired.

With so very many ways a fixture could be wired it's really important to consider all the possibilities until we can better identify how your specific fan is wired.

thanks DaveGee and oTi for the detailed explanation. i will do your suggestions and let you know. i think the power goes to the switch box first and not to the fixture because when both pull chains for the light and fan are still on (lights and on and fan running), the wife will just turn the wall switch off (she can't reach the fan chain). the next day when i turn the wall switch back on, both the light and the fan turn on. what you said  in (1) and (2) could be true; that the motor and/or the pull chain died - to verify this, i will restore back the old regular switch.

because the wife cannot reach the pull chain for the fan (she can reach the light chain only), i am leaning towards buying the switch from home depot for $$32.95 which has 3 fan speed (low, medium, high and off of course) and also light dimming features. ok will post later. thanks again for your input.
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: DaveGee on May 24, 2012, 01:57:29 pm
Ah okay... So the switch did/would kill all power to the fan & lights ... Then it's a better bet that the power begins at the switch/box.  It's still possible power started from the ceiling tho... However if that was the case the switch would have wires coming from only one bundle of wire...

In short, if you have a black coming from one set of wires going to the black wire on the switch and the other black wire coming from a different set of cables connecting to the blue wire on the switch then yes i'd be fairly certain the power is from the box.

And yes, if the switch kills the lights we know power is being cut at the box then as strange as it seems either the fan motor is dead or the pull chain went....

Or...

If the fan motor draws more power then the new switch will tolerate then perhaps that's the problem... Tho I have a pretty beefy Hunter Douglas fan & light combo and just yesterday replaced its ordinary switch with a CA3000 switch... and so far so good however 24 hours isn't much of a yardstick.. lol
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: oTi@ on May 24, 2012, 02:16:19 pm
[...] i think the power goes to the switch box first and not to the fixture [...]
That would be my guess, based on your earlier comments about bundles and having 2 black wires. (Not that colors are a guarantee.)

Quote
[...] to verify this, i will restore back the old regular switch.
That sounds like a good test.
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: waltzer11 on May 30, 2012, 09:02:57 am
[...] i think the power goes to the switch box first and not to the fixture [...]
That would be my guess, based on your earlier comments about bundles and having 2 black wires. (Not that colors are a guarantee.)

Quote
[...] to verify this, i will restore back the old regular switch.
That sounds like a good test.

hi DaveGee and oTi, stupid me. reinstalled the old switch and fan sitll did not work. i took the step ladder and ready to bring down and replace the fan. lo and behold, i noticed the small black button in up position (reverse button i guess); i flipped it down and the fan start moving. i renstalled the CA3000. thanks for your input anyway.
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: bax on June 12, 2012, 06:20:30 pm
Since the thread has been highjacked by a few 'electricians' discussing wires connection issues  ;D (very useful by the way) I would like to bump it with the following questions that seem to be unanswered:

How to force CA3000/CA600 to report status instantly?
How to force indicator light to turn on when the switch is in off position?
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: DaveGee on June 12, 2012, 07:05:35 pm
While I'm no expert I do remember reading several different threads about zwave devices and their inability to report instant status changes... You'd think the zwave spec would have had that covered and patent protected... However from what I'm remembering leviton actually owns a patent that directly prevents all other manufactures from putting that feature in.

I also hazily remember hearing about some manufacturer who did have it as a standard feature and was forced to stop producing and or firmware updating the device so it stopped doing just that. :(
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: PurdueGuy on June 12, 2012, 07:15:25 pm
DaveGee is right...it's a patent issue, but owned by Lutron.   Leviton (and others) pay a license fee to Lutron to allow them to report them instantly.

If you CA600/CA3000 can speak directly to Vera (and not via an intermediate device) then Vera should get the notification.  But there is no guarantee.  The switch essentially says "hey everyone, I just turned on" but there are no acknowledgements back and forth, and Vera might not see the message every time.
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: hugheaves on June 12, 2012, 10:23:43 pm
DaveGee is right...it's a patent issue, but owned by Lutron.   Leviton (and others) pay a license fee to Lutron to allow them to report them instantly.

If you CA600/CA3000 can speak directly to Vera (and not via an intermediate device) then Vera should get the notification.  But there is no guarantee.  The switch essentially says "hey everyone, I just turned on" but there are no acknowledgements back and forth, and Vera might not see the message every time.

Except that Vera doesn't actually do anything with the received data. My Vera receives the data from the switch as soon as it's turned on or off (i.e. without polling), but still doesn't update the Vera device status. I filed a bug report here:

http://bugs.mios.com/view.php?id=2346
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: Timon on June 29, 2012, 04:32:41 am
I detest Lutron, and will never buy any of their products again, for asking for a patent for an obvious idea as sending out a message that "I've changed states" and the patent office should be hung by the toes for granting it. Then the other manufactures should have protested the patent as being obvious in the first place. Our patent system is so damn broken that it needs a total overhaul.

It's the same with Phillips and their patent for Pulse Width Modulation of RGB LEDs to make colors. Mixing colored lights to create colors is nothing new and PWM for controlling the intensity of LEDs was prior art back in the 70's. You should not be able to get a patent for combining them. Again the patent office screwed up in granting it and the other manufactures should protest the patent and get it rejected even now.

DaveGee is right...it's a patent issue, but owned by Lutron.   Leviton (and others) pay a license fee to Lutron to allow them to report them instantly.

If you CA600/CA3000 can speak directly to Vera (and not via an intermediate device) then Vera should get the notification.  But there is no guarantee.  The switch essentially says "hey everyone, I just turned on" but there are no acknowledgements back and forth, and Vera might not see the message every time.
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: micasaverde on August 02, 2012, 07:24:37 pm
I haven't followed the whole thread but was asked to respond to May 07, 2012, 06:15:07 am post by hugheaves that Vera was 'ignoring' the command from the light switch.  The reason is that the light switch was sending a basic_set (0x20 0x1).  That is a command where the light switch is telling Vera to turn on or off; it's a request to Vera, not a report of its own status.  If the switch wanted to tell Vera its status it should send a basic_report (0x20 0x3) which is how a device notifies another what its status is.
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: Dolphran on August 02, 2012, 09:15:34 pm
I haven't followed the whole thread but was asked to respond to May 07, 2012, 06:15:07 am post by hugheaves that Vera was 'ignoring' the command from the light switch.  The reason is that the light switch was sending a basic_set (0x20 0x1).  That is a command where the light switch is telling Vera to turn on or off; it's a request to Vera, not a report of its own status.  If the switch wanted to tell Vera its status it should send a basic_report (0x20 0x3) which is how a device notifies another what its status is.
I don't think the issue is what the switch wants to tell Vera.  The question is what information can Vera interpret from the (perhaps inappropriate) messaging that the switch DOES send.  We currently can't get at the message it sends in luup to create our desired behavior.  Can that be addressed?
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: PurdueGuy on August 02, 2012, 09:18:54 pm
I would think think could be interpreted by Vera the same way it does scene controllers.

For things like Leviton scene controllers, Vera pretends to be a dimmable light, with 1% being for scene 1. I would think Vera could be re-written to pretend to be an off/on light in the same fashion when dealing with a CA600/3000.
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: hugheaves on August 04, 2012, 09:16:13 pm
I haven't followed the whole thread but was asked to respond to May 07, 2012, 06:15:07 am post by hugheaves that Vera was 'ignoring' the command from the light switch.  The reason is that the light switch was sending a basic_set (0x20 0x1).  That is a command where the light switch is telling Vera to turn on or off; it's a request to Vera, not a report of its own status.  If the switch wanted to tell Vera its status it should send a basic_report (0x20 0x3) which is how a device notifies another what its status is.

Thanks for the reply. I didn't know the details of the protocol (that you have now provided), but was under the general impression that Vera would listen for basic_set commands from devices in it's association group, and use those to as a trigger to status for devices that didn't support "instance status" reporting.

As my assumption appears incorrect, would it be possible to actually implement this? I know MCV has a big "to do" list, but at the very least, could this just be used to trigger a poll of the originating device? This would provide a reasonably "real time" update of device statuses for these sorts of devices.

If not, can we get some sort of luup function that operates like luup.watch_variable(), but allows us to register a callback function to listen for raw zwave messages for a specific device, or all devices? That was we (I) could implement it myself.

Maybe something like this:

function: register_zwave_listener
parameters: function_name (string), direction (string), device (number or nil)
returns: nothing

Registers a callback function that receives notification of zwave messages that are either outgoing (vera to device), incoming (device to vera), or both. (specified by direction parameter of "in", "out", or "both"). If the device parameter is nil, the callback function will be called for all devices, instead of the specified device number.


The signature of the callback method would be similar to incoming, where the function receives a copy of the raw data, and the device from which it was received.

Thanks,
Hugh
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: mcvflorin on August 07, 2012, 05:21:27 am
@hugheaves

You should submit a feature request in Mantis (bugs.mios.com) with that function. That is a good idea.
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: hugheaves on August 08, 2012, 02:22:11 am
@hugheaves

You should submit a feature request in Mantis (bugs.mios.com) with that function. That is a good idea.

Done:

http://bugs.mios.com/view.php?id=2503

It would certainly be nice to see this at some point.

Hugh
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: wantonsoup on December 29, 2012, 10:27:49 pm
Very curious - what is the minimum load for these dimmers? I wonder whether a group of 6-8 Ecosmart 9.5W LED bulbs in recessed cans would effectively dim...?

I know these are incandescent dimmers, but I remember reading somewhere that some LED bulbs would work with incandescent dimmers as long as there was a minimum load.

Thanks!
Did you ever get a reply about this - or figure it out on your own?  I'm considering upgrading my bulbs to dimmable LED and don't want to install Zwave dimmers if they won't work.  Please do let me know, thanks.
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: GroundLoop on December 31, 2012, 01:29:05 am
I detest Lutron, and will never buy any of their products again, for asking for a patent for an obvious idea as sending out a message that "I've changed states" and the patent office should be hung by the toes for granting it. Then the other manufactures should have protested the patent as being obvious in the first place. Our patent system is so damn broken that it needs a total overhaul.

It's the same with Phillips and their patent for Pulse Width Modulation of RGB LEDs to make colors. Mixing colored lights to create colors is nothing new and PWM for controlling the intensity of LEDs was prior art back in the 70's. You should not be able to get a patent for combining them. Again the patent office screwed up in granting it and the other manufactures should protest the patent and get it rejected even now.

DaveGee is right...it's a patent issue, but owned by Lutron.   Leviton (and others) pay a license fee to Lutron to allow them to report them instantly.

If you CA600/CA3000 can speak directly to Vera (and not via an intermediate device) then Vera should get the notification.  But there is no guarantee.  The switch essentially says "hey everyone, I just turned on" but there are no acknowledgements back and forth, and Vera might not see the message every time.
The Lutron patent in question is this one:
http://www.google.com/patents/US5905442
which was issued in 1999, so in another four years, we'll be free of it.  Sad when innovation depends on a patent expiring.
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: garrettwp on December 31, 2012, 03:41:53 am
Good find GroundLoop. Never tempted to find the patent info. Sad we have to wait another 4 years.

- Garrett
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: simdude on January 18, 2013, 09:23:29 am
Very curious - what is the minimum load for these dimmers? I wonder whether a group of 6-8 Ecosmart 9.5W LED bulbs in recessed cans would effectively dim...?

I know these are incandescent dimmers, but I remember reading somewhere that some LED bulbs would work with incandescent dimmers as long as there was a minimum load.

Thanks!

I know this is an older post but I'm also curious on alternate dimmable bulbs with CA600 dimmers. I have a ton of these in the house and with incandescents going away, I'm wondering if any LED dimmables will work. I know I tried a dimmable CFL once before in a floor lamp and the results were not good. The bulb in general ran warm for a CFL even without a dimmable zwave module. When I tried the dimmable module, the bulb died in about a week.

I'm also wondering if the LED's would work if they are in a track lighting fixture with multiple bulbs? But even 6-8 bulbs with only 5-10 watts each won't draw much. The problem is even with the electric savings of the LED's, changing all my switches over to non-dimmables would take me about 10 years to recover the cost.
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: nasa01 on January 30, 2013, 05:22:31 am
Hi (new to the forum and z-wave)

I would love to find out the same info as well, hopefully someone knows (or knows where the info is)...

Thanks!
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: radarengineer on February 02, 2013, 11:38:17 am
I know this is an older post but I'm also curious on alternate dimmable bulbs with CA600 dimmers.

If you search the forums there are many many posts on this subject (for instance: http://forum.micasaverde.com/index.php?topic=6074.0).

I use lot of LEDs with dimmers in my house. First, make sure the LEDs are dimmable. Using non-dimmable LEDs with a dimmer is a fire hazard. I typically need about 30W worth of LEDs to dim correctly (not stay dimly on when the dimmer is off) with my GE dimmers that do not use a neutral. If you have a dimmer that uses a neutral then this isn't a problem. That is because the dimmer itself needs a bit of power to run the z-wave radio - and if there isn't a neutral line that power has to go through the load (i.e., the LED bulbs).

As these switches require a neutral I expect that you don't need a 30w minimum, but I haven't tried them yet. I have a big box of CA600s in my garage so I may eventually.

If you have problems you could also always put a dummy load in series with the light bulbs:
http://forum.micasaverde.com/index.php?topic=9262.0
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: swazi on May 28, 2013, 09:34:43 am
The thread that won't die...
Just to add some info: I tried a CA600 with a 36w dimmable LED load (2x 18w). Ramp rate was smooth but they would not completely turn off.
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: greenhighlighter on May 28, 2013, 04:12:31 pm
The thread that won't die...
Just to add some info: I tried a CA600 with a 36w dimmable LED load (2x 18w). Ramp rate was smooth but they would not completely turn off.

I tried with 4 18w LEDs and had the same result.  Swap out one of the LEDs with an incandescent and they all work find.  My electrician is going to try the TimsAll dummy load thing.  We'll see.
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: swazi on May 29, 2013, 10:50:44 am
I tried with 4 18w LEDs and had the same result.  Swap out one of the LEDs with an incandescent and they all work find.  My electrician is going to try the TimsAll dummy load thing.  We'll see.

Now this is interesting - you are up to 72w and the advertised min load is 40w
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: syyid on June 03, 2013, 12:13:24 am
Weird unrelated note. I have a bunch of these (non dimming) installed and we lost power and all of them stopped working completely which freaked me out a little. Flipping their respective circuits off and on from the circuit breaker re-energized them and they're working fine again. I also have a few GE switches that did not have any issues
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: tipton on June 03, 2013, 03:02:49 pm
I'm a newbie with some of these in the mail to be delivered this week.

i have a question about using these on a 3 way switch.  is it possible to install one CA600 on one end and keep the standard switch on the other to obtain the same results?  i wasn't sure what the proper install was to achieve this.  thanks.
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: Freakin on June 03, 2013, 03:16:18 pm
I'm a newbie with some of these in the mail to be delivered this week.

i have a question about using these on a 3 way switch.  is it possible to install one CA600 on one end and keep the standard switch on the other to obtain the same results?  i wasn't sure what the proper install was to achieve this.  thanks.

Yes.  You can use a single CA600 in a 3-way circuit with either a 2 way or 3 way traditional switch at the other point.  Pretty sure the wiring diagram is in teh included instructions, and I think the CA600 has to go closest to the live wire.

Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: Chris H. on June 03, 2013, 03:33:49 pm
I have the CA600 and CA3000 Dimmers and Relays in my house controlling all lights. They work great for just replacing one of the switches in a 3/4 way wiring, although I did purchase the CA5100 remote switches so they would match the rest per my wife's instruction :(

You won't be able to find the CA3000 anymore but you can still pick up the CA600 on ebay in a pack of 6 for $99 which comes out just under $20 per switch, the perfect price. The Z-Wave licensing will eventually be the doom of Z-Wave if it is not corrected, this is why Intermatic stopped selling Z-Wave devices. I just can't see paying $50-$60 for a switch and some are up to $140 per switch, multiply that by 20-40 switches in your house and it gets very expensive.

The only problem I have now is that since I used the dimmers I have to use incandescent light bulbs instead of CFL or LED. I am still searching for an LED light that will work with the dimmers correctly (meaning the light turns all the way off when you turn the switch off).
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: Freakin on June 03, 2013, 04:05:26 pm
I have the CA600 and CA3000 Dimmers and Relays in my house controlling all lights. They work great for just replacing one of the switches in a 3/4 way wiring, although I did purchase the CA5100 remote switches so they would match the rest per my wife's instruction :(

You won't be able to find the CA3000 anymore but you can still pick up the CA600 on ebay in a pack of 6 for $99 which comes out just under $20 per switch, the perfect price. The Z-Wave licensing will eventually be the doom of Z-Wave if it is not corrected, this is why Intermatic stopped selling Z-Wave devices. I just can't see paying $50-$60 for a switch and some are up to $140 per switch, multiply that by 20-40 switches in your house and it gets very expensive.

The only problem I have now is that since I used the dimmers I have to use incandescent light bulbs instead of CFL or LED. I am still searching for an LED light that will work with the dimmers correctly (meaning the light turns all the way off when you turn the switch off).

Not possible with the CA600 based on design.  It has to pass power through the bulb to operate itself since it lacks a neutral.  The only option is to install a dummy load on the line (25W resistor) so that the bulbs don't get the power.  But this essentially means you're chewing up 25W at all times per circuit just to save money with home automation :-\
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: Exorcist on June 04, 2013, 09:17:33 pm
Few more left. Get it before its gone.
I got cooper just before i saw this.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/CA600-Intermatic-Z-Wave-InTouch-600-Watt-Dimmer-On-Off-Switch-Vera-SmartThings-/350808166321?pt=Home_Automation_Modules&hash=item51adcbcfb1
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: Freakin on June 04, 2013, 10:09:32 pm
Automated Outlet still has the 6 packs for $100
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Intermatic-Z-Wave-InTouch-600-Watt-Dimmer-CA600-6-PACK/130903456048?ssPageName=WDVW&rd=1&ih=003&category=94879&cmd=ViewItem

They also have the CA5100 companion switches for 6/$70
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: Exorcist on June 04, 2013, 10:11:26 pm
Automated Outlet still has the 6 packs for $100
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Intermatic-Z-Wave-InTouch-600-Watt-Dimmer-CA600-6-PACK/130903456048?ssPageName=WDVW&rd=1&ih=003&category=94879&cmd=ViewItem

They also have the CA5100 companion switches for 6/$70

I read a lot of issues with CA600.. is it that bad? like the buzz sound and some dimming issues.
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: kkl on June 05, 2013, 12:38:49 am
I read a lot of issues with CA600.. is it that bad? like the buzz sound and some dimming issues.
People tend to only post when they're having a problem.  I've got five installed.  Never had a buzzing issue.  I did have one that sometimes interacted with another circuit and would brighten and dim.  Eventually that one became unresponsive in the On position and got very hot.  AutomatedOutlet replaced it under warranty without any problems.  The replacement hasn't shown the same problem.

Its advantages are cost and the use of standard switches in multi-way circuits.  Disadvantages are that it's no longer made or supported by Intermatic (but Automated Outlet does support the ones it sells), and lack of instant status like most non-Leviton brands.
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: Exorcist on June 05, 2013, 04:30:06 am
I read a lot of issues with CA600.. is it that bad? like the buzz sound and some dimming issues.
People tend to only post when they're having a problem.  I've got five installed.  Never had a buzzing issue.  I did have one that sometimes interacted with another circuit and would brighten and dim.  Eventually that one became unresponsive in the On position and got very hot.  AutomatedOutlet replaced it under warranty without any problems.  The replacement hasn't shown the same problem.

Its advantages are cost and the use of standard switches in multi-way circuits.  Disadvantages are that it's no longer made or supported by Intermatic (but Automated Outlet does support the ones it sells), and lack of instant status like most non-Leviton brands.

Thanks for that info. Reading ur post i gathered the guts to order a pack of six from them from the ebay link.
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: greenhighlighter on June 05, 2013, 12:05:04 pm
Automated Outlet still has the 6 packs for $100
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Intermatic-Z-Wave-InTouch-600-Watt-Dimmer-CA600-6-PACK/130903456048?ssPageName=WDVW&rd=1&ih=003&category=94879&cmd=ViewItem

They also have the CA5100 companion switches for 6/$70

I'm not sure I get the CA5100.  What do they do?  Are they just 2-scene controllers?
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: Freakin on June 05, 2013, 12:25:42 pm
Automated Outlet still has the 6 packs for $100
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Intermatic-Z-Wave-InTouch-600-Watt-Dimmer-CA600-6-PACK/130903456048?ssPageName=WDVW&rd=1&ih=003&category=94879&cmd=ViewItem

They also have the CA5100 companion switches for 6/$70

I'm not sure I get the CA5100.  What do they do?  Are they just 2-scene controllers?

Yeah 2-scene controller (up/down), or use it in a 3-way with a CA600 for remote dimming control.  I think the latter is done through direct association, not through Vera, but don't quote me on that.

http://wiki.micasaverde.com/index.php/Intermatic_CA5100_Set_Up_Scene
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: greenhighlighter on June 05, 2013, 12:37:42 pm
Automated Outlet still has the 6 packs for $100
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Intermatic-Z-Wave-InTouch-600-Watt-Dimmer-CA600-6-PACK/130903456048?ssPageName=WDVW&rd=1&ih=003&category=94879&cmd=ViewItem

They also have the CA5100 companion switches for 6/$70

I'm not sure I get the CA5100.  What do they do?  Are they just 2-scene controllers?

Yeah 2-scene controller (up/down), or use it in a 3-way with a CA600 for remote dimming control.  I think the latter is done through direct association, not through Vera, but don't quote me on that.

http://wiki.micasaverde.com/index.php/Intermatic_CA5100_Set_Up_Scene

I thought you could use any switch to go with the CA600?
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: kkl on June 05, 2013, 02:03:00 pm
The CA600/CA3000 are used with standard switches in multi-way circuits.  However, for 3 or more switches total, an extra wire is required that isn't found in most standard wiring schemes.

The CA5100 can be used as a scene controller or configured to be associated with another Z-wave switch as Freakin suggested.  The association is done through Vera.  This is the way I have one configured and it doesn't control dimming, only On/Off.  It needs a hot/line, neutral, and ground from any circuit.  It can be used with the CA600/CA3000 where you want the other switches to match in appearance, or where you don't have that extra wire needed for 3 or more switches.

I have posted many times about the vagaries of wiring these switches, so anyone contemplating their use may want to look back through the forum.
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: Exorcist on June 09, 2013, 01:18:39 am
I received the ca600 switched today, and I must say the build quality is really good. The switches came well packed. Automated outlet are good sellers I wished they did more cheaper zwave stuff. Anyways have a quick question here, the ca600 has four wires coming out. Red, black, green, blue. See pic below

The switches that I want to replace these with have two wires coming out. So my question is.. which of these wires should I use in ca600 switch. Pls look at the wiring of my current switches in the second image below.

As you can see that i have a yellow on the top and blue wiring on the bottom.. Where does the yellow wire and the blue wire of my existing wiring go into the ca600? Please see the first picture for ca600's wiring.

Are my assumptions correct...?
Yellow goes to red of ca600 and blue goes to black of ca600? Is it correct? If so can I cut off the other two wires from the ca600.
Pls note these switches will be used as a standalone dimmer not 3 way.

(http://i.imgur.com/7RM4ncb.jpg)

(http://i.imgur.com/ykqQk3s.jpg)
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: kkl on June 09, 2013, 11:20:36 am
Where does the yellow wire and the blue wire of my existing wiring go into the ca600?
Are you located in the US?  I've never seen yellow and blue colored wires.  You need to know or figure out which one comes from the load center (breaker box), that is your hot/line which connects to the CA600 black wire.  The blue wire goes to the light/load.  The red wire is capped off in a 2-way circuit.  Where is your ground wire?  The green wire needs to connect to ground.  If you don't know how to figure this out, then it may be dangerous for you to try.
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: Exorcist on June 09, 2013, 11:25:28 am
Yes I am based in Chicago.
Ok I have a multimeter. It's been a very very long time since I have used it. In theory I am supposed to point one needle to the black wire and other needle to the metal gang box to figure out if the black wire is hot or not.. Is that right?

There are a few white wires capped off inside the gang box.

But as for the current switch wiring, u can see only two wires are attached to the switch.. the blue and the yellow.. a ground wire is not connected.. so is it mandatory to attach a ground wire to the ca600 switch?
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: kkl on June 10, 2013, 12:07:45 am
Yes I am based in Chicago.
Ok I have a multimeter. It's been a very very long time since I have used it. In theory I am supposed to point one needle to the black wire and other needle to the metal gang box to figure out if the black wire is hot or not.. Is that right?

There are a few white wires capped off inside the gang box.

But as for the current switch wiring, u can see only two wires are attached to the switch.. the blue and the yellow.. a ground wire is not connected.. so is it mandatory to attach a ground wire to the ca600 switch?

Connecting your multimeter to the metal gang box may not work, since you say you don't have a ground wire.  Usually, metal boxes are grounded.  Are you sure that yours isn't?  You could use your multimeter to test between the colored wires and neutral (white wires).  The hot/line wire will show ~120v when the breaker is switched back on, and the light/load wire should show 0v.  Here's an article (http://ecmweb.com/content/diagnosing-power-problems-receptacle).  I don't know if the CA600 will work without a ground.  I've never tried and it may be a safety hazard.
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: smwein on June 11, 2013, 01:22:49 pm
Hi Guys,

Total newbie when comes to Zwave.  I'm wondering if I can use a CA600 as standard switch or if I have to have dimmable lights.  Also can I use it with CFL dimmables or LED dimmables?

Thanks for the help.
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: garrettwp on June 11, 2013, 01:26:00 pm
A CA600 will still act life a dimmable light. There is no way to have it turn on or off instantly like a relay. Some LED's may work (your milage will very), but most of these switches that do not have a neutral has a minimum load and may cause weird flickering with led bulbs. I would not use CFL bulbs.

- Garrett
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: smwein on June 11, 2013, 03:02:00 pm
Ok then I can't use my CA600 can anyone recommend a cheap relay switch.

Thanks
 
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: Freakin on June 12, 2013, 02:38:02 pm
Ok then I can't use my CA600 can anyone recommend a cheap relay switch.

Thanks

GE 45609
$35 at Lowes

http://store.homeseer.com/store/HomeSeer-Z-Wave-OnOff-Wall-Switch-Comparison-W7.aspx
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: kyb2012 on June 28, 2013, 10:37:41 pm
Are the intermatic switches the only ones that can be used in a 3way with regular switches?  Any others that don't require an auxiliary switch?
Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: kkl on June 29, 2013, 06:49:34 pm
Not possible with the CA600 based on design.  It has to pass power through the bulb to operate itself since it lacks a neutral.  The only option is to install a dummy load on the line (25W resistor) so that the bulbs don't get the power.  But this essentially means you're chewing up 25W at all times per circuit just to save money with home automation :-\
I do not believe that this conclusion is correct.  The proposed resistor (http://forum.micasaverde.com/index.php/topic,9262.msg112005.html#msg112005) is the KAL25FB1K50 1.5K OHM 25W Resistor (http://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/KAL25FB1K50/KAL25FB1K50-ND/1646191?cur=USD).  25 watts is not the amount of power it draws or requires, like a light bulb rating, it is the maximum amount of power that the resistor can dissipate (http://www.electronics-tutorials.ws/resistor/res_7.html).  This resistor is rated at 1500 ohms, so at the American standard of 115 volts, it would draw 0.07667 amps and 8.81667 watts per Ohms law calculations (http://www.ohmslawcalculator.com/ohms_law_calculator.php).

When the switch is off, the circuit would draw no more than the trickle it usually does.  From a previous wise poster (http://forum.micasaverde.com/index.php/topic,4210.msg22224.html#msg22224):

The reason for the requirement of the neutral wire is that the ZWave radio needs power to operate.

Those switches that do not require a neutral get their power by sending a small amount of current through the load, but not enough to cause the light bulb to light up.

Non-incandescent light bulbs usually do not tolerate having that small current constantly running through it.

So that is why there is a requirement for the neutral wire to the switch, for all ZWave switches other than switches only controlling incandescent lights.

Title: Re: Sale on CA3000 / CA600 Z-wave Switches / Dimmers
Post by: cmasner on January 15, 2015, 01:48:04 pm
I realize this thread is old, but I thought I would add information for anyone that might need it in the future.  The instructions for CA600 and other Intermatic devices say to refer to the InTouch User/Install guide for information.  The link is no longer active on the Intermatic site, but I have located a copy of the guide through another source.  Here it is, in case anyone might need it in the future.

http://waterheatertimer.org/pdf/In-touch-User-Guide-English.pdf